Freddie Boy, The price has been paid, we just have to sign the receipt...love you guys.
Mark
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 21:52:32 (MDT)

Seventeen has turned fifty-five.... I´m surprised that we´re still livin.....´ if we´ve done any thing wrong...... I hope that we´re forgiven
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 21:04:33 (MDT)

Gale Beard, don`t you dare belittle yourself, you said more with a few kind words, than us "hell raiser`s" could say. Guys like Kim and I have been doing this as " Ole Union Reps" for years, we have a lot of rehearsals. We both have spent alot of time shouting down a union hall mobs(members). Animal(Greg)....He`s a artist/craftsman, that sells his goods, so he`s gotta be a communicator to keep bread and butter on the table and pay that mortgage. So we`ve done a lot of debating(talking) as a system of survival.
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 20:56:55 (MDT)

Fred A. Funny that you mention that. I was at a gas station the other day and I could not see the sign that gave the price for gas. But a sign by the pump caught my attention. It had hugh numbers on it that said $1.78. I thought WOW, this is the place to fill up. I walked over to the pump and it was a $1.78 for a 2 LITER of pop........ " Back when a smoke was a smoke, and groovin' was groovin'"."Where have all the flowers gone"............I stand behind our troops but, WAR SUCKS.....was watching that show "Shoot Out" on the history channel last night.........................always a brother, Love you all, Kokomo soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mark
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 20:00:06 (MDT)

lou,hang in there buddy.I know what you are going thru,watched susan get so damn tired of hurting and being hurt...every damn time she saw ANYBODY.Gas here in indy jumped to 3.19 today.Remember the good old days when it only cost 1.98? I recieved an email saying a can of coke cost 6 bucks in new oleans now.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 18:03:45 (MDT)

Why do we always neglect what Walter Cronkhite?!?!? HE was the one, who said, on National tv, that we were wrong, had been lied to, and COULD NOT WIN in Vietnam. He had a lot more to do with public opinion turning against us that slut jane did!...my opinion, if freedom isn't free, it isn't freedom!!! We have some liberties, more than a lot of other nations do. WE have them because people are willing to do what's necessary to keep them. At the same time, we're giving away our precious freedomn's, in the name of staying free???? Did anyone read 1984? We're victim's of our own termiology. it's been announced that Cindy Sheehan is coming to Brunswick Naval air Station this weekend, to bring her protest to the Air show. I don't think that's a very good idea on her part. Maine may be a 'blue state', but, we are partiotic, and I don't think too many folks would hold it against the Blue Angels that we're in Iraq! As I've said here many times, for the most part, soldiers don't have much say about where they're going to serve. If we join, we go where the president sends us. And as long as we're going. we might's well try to win! As a civilian, I DO have a choice, and I choose to think we have no good reason to be in Iraq. It's a shame that American's are dying over there, protecting oil company's interests, and FORCING DEMOCRACY??? on a country?
Kim
Livermore, Me USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 18:02:11 (MDT)

Frank, I agree with you that there's a difference between the "cold war" and our present circomstances. As far as 9/11 is concerned, however, shouldn't we be invading Saudi Arabia since most of the terrorists were from there? As far as suicide bombers are concerned, if we were energy independent, we wouldn't need to be there for them to target. Let them blow each other up like they've done for generations. I've never advocated letting our enemies off lightly. My point is that there are other ways to wage war that are just as effective, but more "soldier friendly". Our soldiers are too valuable to waste on protecting the profits of the oil industry. Especially when that industry can be replaced with new technology. It's going to be difficult to convince me that we're over there for any other reason than oil. To bring them democracy? If someone has to force it on them, they don't deserve it. Instead of us groveling for their oil, they should be groveling for our technology, agriculture, and freedom. We do have other weapons, but the first step is to break our addiction to oil, and vote out the "Pushers" who profit from it. My prayers go out to the people of New Orleans. With respect Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 17:31:19 (MDT)

Thanks Fred....me thinks! :o] You know me. I can't keep up with you big dogs in the debating field, so, I have to get it down to my level in order to get my $.02 worth in. LOL. Flight, our thoughts & prayers go out to all brothers, sisters & families in the grief stricken South. How horrible all that mess must be. If anyone hears of one of ours that needs help...please let us know. Gale 67-68
Gale
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 17:25:38 (MDT)

I meant to say " death toll could be thousands"
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 16:09:52 (MDT)

Gale, you`re always the gentleman.....and the "voice of reason"......Right now I`m in total shock about paying $2.60 gallon yesterday and $3.12 today. Can someone please explain this to me.....how are they charging for something that was paid for last week at certain price....Then they just arbitrarily raise the friggin price on the same tank of fuel.......Where does the damn greed stop......Mr. Bush should show America that he can and will use his 'relationship' with oil industry insiders for the benefit of Americans....that will never happen...I tell you what, I feel for those poor souls in New Orleans. The mayor said the death toll could thousands.......
Fred Skaggs
Secaucus, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 15:53:16 (MDT)

Turn out the lights the party is over in New Orleans. Lou, hang in there my friend. Sometimes I think that is the aim of VA to wear us down with turn downs & paper work, make us give up & quit. Animal nothing "Cold Warish" about 9/11 or a suicide bomber. Frank 68/69.
Frank Loveday
Bastrop, La. USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 14:54:47 (MDT)

Hi Flight, just returned from VA, it seems everytime I go theres more bad news for me. I hurt all over from sticking all those damm needles in me everyday, don't know how much more I can take. I so tired, don't know if its worth it anymore.
Lou Rags
Dover, De USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 12:39:28 (MDT)

Not "bees(s)"......beers! L-G
Gently
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 12:37:29 (MDT)

Thanks Gail:>) You're one smart cookie. Looking forward to the bee(s) and the "talk." Fred and Wink...come on..I thought you guys knew me:>)) Dah! Freddie, Freddie, Freddie:>) At least our disagreements posted on the web this time around are polite. And I attriibute to that to our being the "united for each other" family we have become. L to all-Gently
Gently
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 12:35:00 (MDT)

PTSD Reviews Update: "According to VA spokesman Scott Hogenson the planned review of the 72,000 cases likely won't begin until January." My friends, it is my understanding that if you are notified you will have only 60 days to "prove" your "reason" for your claim. So, if I may, I'd like to suggest that you start getting your "proof" organized now. I don't mean to alarm you, but this is very serious. Please be prepared. L-Gently
Gently
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 12:26:21 (MDT)

It's possible to be patriotic and against the war. Remember the last war we won? We achieved this victory without the death and maiming of thousands of our precious soldiers. I'm talking about the "Cold War". Reagon brought the Soviet Union to it's knees using our economy and technology against them instead of our nation's youth. They couldn't keep up with our technololgical prowess, and went broke trying. To me this is really "supporting our troops". I admit that at the time I wasn't a huge fan of Ronald, and that his great achievement may not have been altogether intentional, but we could still learn a lesson from it today. If we spent a fraction of the war budget developing alternative fuels we wouldn't have to send all our money to the Ragheads. Our armed forces could concentrate on tracking down and killing Ossama Bin Ladin, and not protecting the interests of the oil industry. I think the current administration is leading us astray to enrich themselves. It seems to me our forfathers felt the same way about their "Leaders", and I certainly consider them Patriots. I support our Troops, I am a Patriot, I am against this war in it's present form. With respect, Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 11:47:25 (MDT)

congrats Bill hope it all works out for him. Good deal. be CAREFUL OUT THERE
Rick England
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 10:33:44 (MDT)

Hey Flight: Now and then I see some of you asking about someone from the "old days". If you are trying to find someone, send me an email with as much info as you have (ie. hometown, age, serial #)and I'll have one of my researchers try to locate the person. So far we have about an 80% success rate. Also: Keep your fingers crossed for me, my son who is in the 82nd Airborne Division is applying for West Point (at the Army's urging)!!! Whooooaahhhh!!!!!!
Bill Wolf <VNHeloReunion@aol.com>
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 10:01:56 (MDT)

Alrighty then...........I really don't think that Gently was serious about the invite. That's just her "mean streak" showing. ;o) Wink, Kal...I don't see how you can compare Cindy to Hanoi Jane, but,as much as I disagree with most of what you both have written in here lately.............there's not a wedge big enuff to come between us or anyone else in here. I love you guys no matter what. We all have our opinions. Put them out there, beat 'em around, kick 'em, but, hope we can all sit down and "break bread" or have a drink together. I love ya all no matter what you write in here. Gently,I'll be at Kokomo on Friday (around noonish this time) and we'll have a "brewskie" and talk about Wink & Kal!! LOL Kal, we'll miss ya buddy! Mark & Dee, can't wait to see you guys again. Clear, Gale
Gale
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 09:04:58 (MDT)

gently, i have admired you for what you have done for the vets for years but i must ask why you would ask someone like sheehan to kokomo? i've never been to kokomo an one day i hope too. why understanding that kokomo is a heaven for vets their family an friends.kokomo has no room for politic an if she except your invite an goes i fear what will happen because of it. she of cource will bring her circus with her an change kokomo for ever. kokomo dose'nt need her kind of politic or any other at that fact. all she will end up doing is put a wegde in between the vets there. yes she was the rightbut i'm sure her son would not want her to do what she is doing, an i say this because if i had died in veit nam i would not want my mother doing what sheehan is doing. freedom is not free.all sheehan is doing is putting a wedge splitting this country in have, just as fonda did years ago.i do not want the iraq vets to go through what we did for years and still do to this day. gently don't take afend to my comments, that not why i wrote this because i as well as you are entitled to our own opinions thats why so many before us an after us has given their live for. please rethink your invite to sheehan an resend it. oh an gently don't think this changes my opinion of you. i still admire you wink 3/69-10/70
wink
lake wales, fl USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 08:35:53 (MDT)

wouldnt it be just wonderful if jihad jane jumped off her antiwar tour at kokomo?
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 07:47:38 (MDT)

Hello Flight.... Well I guess it is time to put my $.02 in.. I feel that it is people like Cindy S. and Jane NOT-so-Fonda that cost us our war. We had them so beat after the 68 TET that they were ready to fold up. Every time Uncle Ho would get wind of another war protest he would send another fresh supply of troops our way. Granted, it is too bad what happened to her son but, it is also too bad for the troops that are trying to fight the present war. I feel we should have finnished the job in Afganistan before marching into Bagdad but I have to sit back and watch as my opinion wasn't requested. You have to admit that those terrorists have vowed to kill us and you have seen that they have the potential and means to do the job with the fall of the twin towers. I'd much rather be fighting over there than living in fear and uncertainity here. The cost of war is great and wearing on our people but like it or not they are coming to get us!.. It is too bad that it is driving a wedge between us. Well, enough said for now. I hope al of us have a nice holiday weekend. Take care.. With love and respect.... C ya.... Kal...>>>
Kal Bergstrom 67/68
Saint Joseph, MI USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 07:35:11 (MDT)

Now Fred....:>))
Gently
USA - Wednesday, August 31, 2005 at 06:37:28 (MDT)

if cindy S. is going to kokomo,i aint.
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 22:00:24 (MDT)

To those who might be intrested: From page 6, VFW Mag,Sep 2005. VFW Coordinating Trip To Vietnam in Apr 06. VFW's Programs Dept is coordinating an 8 day trip to RVN 7 - 16 Apr 06 for Vietnam Vets. Tour stops include Saigon, the Cu Chi Tunnels, Mekong River, Hue, DMZ, Hoi An, Red Beach, Marble Mountain and China Beach. As was last year's trip to Vietnam, this one is designed especially for returning war vets who desire to revisit former battlefields. A small portion of the tour price will be donated to the VFW Veterans Tribute Scholarship. The trip is limited to 40 people. The deadline for reserving space is 15 Nov. For details on cost, accommodations,meals and travel documents, contact Michael Gormalley in VFW Programs at mgormalley@vfw.org or call (816) 968-1125 in Kansas City, MO. Sir Izk Newton
Jack Newton <SirIzk@centurytel.net>
Tomah, WI USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 17:47:17 (MDT)

Jim, Don't recognize the name. I went over to Corps HQ as the Corps MO shortly after this happened and did not get too involved with the fielding except from a logistical point. I beleive CW3 John Pike from 394th was more involved "out in the field". He was the 394th QC officer. At Corps, due to lack of LTCs and MAJs I ended up as the MO for all corps systems not only aircraft. As a CW4 I was pretty cheap help filling both slots. Had a great crew of senior NCOs with one for each major area ie: aircraft, armor, engineer etc. Good damn thing too. I could just about tell you everything I knew about a tank in two short words: Not Much. Was fun job and learned a lot. Finished my career at it. Oh yeah- there was another 394th guy, a CW3 named Nick ???, I think he was also involved. Do either sound familiar?
Jeff
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 16:56:47 (MDT)

Hey Jeff, did you know Ross Palmer, how about any of the 60 pilots from Ft Campbell that went over to Germany. Just curious, i was at Ft Campbell for 7yrs and was on the fielding team for the Uh-60. I have more time in hawks than the huey. Thought you guys might like to see some of the new stuff, Take care brothers
Jim Oliver
sav, ga USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 16:43:57 (MDT)

Good UH-60/UH-1 story: I was with the 394th Trans Bn in Stuttgart when the first 2 Blackhawks arrived in Europe. 394th was the VII Corps maintenance battalion and we took initial ownership of the two aircraft. Since their arrival was a big deal Armed Forces TV sent a news team and camera crew out to do a story on them. I guess they wanted to make sure the soviet block had the information correct. Anyway the plan was to fly the one 60 as the film subject and use the second one as the camera ship. Well the camera ship would not start no matter what was tried. After many attempts the camera was moved to a good old Huey, which BTW, started on the first try. It may have been old but like good scotch it had only improved with age.
Jeff
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 15:50:01 (MDT)

Westy I playon poker stars also. Maybe we can get togethere on this. check with Mr chung he will send you one sign in and there is pics from the 70's there. Jim I will check the site out bud thanks. JW that is a good one I love it I am ready I'll take the Huey though.hehehehehe
Rick England
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 15:37:44 (MDT)

I sure hope that all of our brothers weathered this storm and come out of it in good shape. Good to see you post JW, i also got a laugh, maby because so much of that is true. Oh for you old bold pilots and the young at heart crewchiefs here's a web site you can go to and see what you'll be flying. www.uh60.com, i think you might enjoy seeing some of the new stuff that our guys are flying now days. We'll be getting 2 trailer mounted Uh-60m's next year,,goint to be fun. Take care everyone and keep our family in your prayers, the stickman is outta here
Jim Oliver
Sav, ga USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 15:04:35 (MDT)

I love you all....but damn, I sure wanted to join Cindy in Texas. Go Nancy Zimpher:>)))) Clean 'em all up! LOL! Really LOL!! Joe and I are going to Kokomo.....any other takers? I invited Cindy, Mr. Alvis. Thought you might enjoy that. And while you're talking to her, I'll take Susie and hid because there are going to be more Iraqi Vets there than last year....and they are not coming home healthy! Remember you guys??? Remember???? How many of you went back to Nam just last night? It's called PTSD for them too....and we ain't seen nothin yet. Time to bring 'em home. I love you all-really. Gently
Gently
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 15:02:16 (MDT)

JW et al: I'm game. Do you think they make a Huey with an armored lift chair? Oh yeah-will need a small step stool to get up to the cockpit. Seriously, you gave me a good laugh. Smitty-we could take care of each other. I give a mean enema. Opps-don't take that the wrong way. Can one draw social security and flight pay??? Snapper out!
Jeff
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 11:21:50 (MDT)

Rick, congrats on your grandson, say where ( what site do you play poker online) i use pokerstars.com. I was in the Rok site & neat stuff but before my time. would be nice to have one of those tiger div patches. JW, very funny stuff, got to thinking i would spend most of the time getting & taking pills to keep me going. My best effort would be to be taken prisoner & it would take 3 of them to take care of me>>> respects to all>> Smitty
jim westwang 71-72
sheridan, wy USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 08:56:20 (MDT)

JW - almost peed my pants laughing!!! Then I stopped and realized this was probably serious!!!! Most of us would need to get a waiver for GOITS syndrome (as my doctor called it) before enlisting (Getting Old Is The Shits)!!!!!!
Bill Wolf <VNHeloReunion@aol.com>
USA - Tuesday, August 30, 2005 at 08:14:57 (MDT)

Janes jealouse boys....cindy is getting all the "pr" so janes hitting the road next month to jump on the bandwagon.
alvis
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 21:59:06 (MDT)

For Fred S and Fred A, an e-mail I'm over 70 now and the Armed Forces say I'm too old to track down terrorists. You can't be older than 35 to join the military. They've got the whole thing backwards. Instead of sending 18-year-olds off to fight, they ought to take us old guys. You shouldn't be able to join until you're at least 35. For starters: Researchers say 18-year- olds think about sex every 10 seconds. Old guys only think about sex a couple of times a day, leaving us more than 28,000 additional seconds per day to concentrate on the enemy. Young guys haven't lived long enough to be cranky, and a cranky soldier is a dangerous soldier. If we can't kill the enemy we'll complain them into submission. "My back hurts!" "I'm hungry!" "Where's the remote control?" An 18-year-old hasn't had a legal beer yet and you shouldn't go to war until you're at least old enough to legally drink. An average old guy, on the other hand, has consumed 126,000 gallons of beer by the time he's 35 and a jaunt through the desert heat with a backpack and M-60 would do wonders for the old beer belly. An 18-year-old doesn't like to get up before 10 a.m. Old guys get up early every morning to pee. If old guys are captured, we couldn't spill the beans because we'd probably forget where we put them. In fact, name, rank, and serial number would be a real brainteaser. Boot camp would actually be easier for old guys. We're used to getting screamed a nd yelled at and we actually like soft food. We've also developed a deep appreciation for guns and rifles. We like them almost better than naps. They could lighten up on the obstacle course, however. I've been in combat and I didn't see a single 20-foot wall with rope hanging over the side, nor did I ever do any pushups after completing basic training. I can hear the Drill Sergeant now, "Get down and give me...er...one." And the running part is kind of a waste of energy. I've never seen anyone outrun a bullet. An 18-year-old has the whole world ahead of him. He's still learning to shave, to actually carry on a conversation, and to wear pants without the top of his butt crack showing and his boxer shorts sticking out. He still hasn't figured out that a pierced tongue catches food particles, and that a 400-watt speaker in the back seat of a Honda Accord can rupture an eardrum. All great reasons to keep our sons at home to learn a little more about life before sending them off to possible death. Let us old guys track down those dirty rotten cowards who attacked our hearts on September 11. The last thing the enemy would want to see right now is a couple of million old farts with attitudes. Share this with your senior friends. (It's purposely in big type for us)
J.W. Wilson
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 19:02:45 (MDT)

Thanks Bill. I was checking out the pics on the ROK site good pics and some of our AOs'
Rick England
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 09:33:42 (MDT)

Rick, Congratulations!!!! Bill
Bill Wolf <VNHeloReunion@aol.com>
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 09:25:23 (MDT)

Thanks Robbie. Yes by all means get out of Katrina's way. Be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 07:30:49 (MDT)

Rick, Congratulations on the new Grandson. Always nice to have a boy to carry on the family name. For those people on the coast in the path of Katrina, I hope you're already gone.....Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 05:55:28 (MDT)

Mark sometimes I have to disable my firewall to get into certain things or maybe check your cookies alert level. I play poker online I have to disable my firewall.
Rick England
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 04:45:24 (MDT)

Mark that's the one. I don't know whats wrong. Maybe Rick J. can help.*******I am a grandfather again its a boy 8lbs 21 inches long. His name is Kade Crandall England. So far he is the only one to carry the name on. Its 5th geneeration for that to happen hopefully their will be more. Mother and father are doing good. BOrn yesturday coming home today. Be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Monday, August 29, 2005 at 03:53:49 (MDT)

Hi all.....back form Pittsburg safe and sound.....Hey Rick E. I try to post a message on the Tiger Page and keep getting a EWRROR message. It's the same white board that I see yours and Bernie's post. Can you advise me brother?.........always a brother.
Mark
USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 20:39:53 (MDT)

Frank, with ALL due respect, does the name Jerry Rubin ring a bell?..... Jerry was a high-profile social activist during the 1960s and 1970s. Rubin was the son of a bread delivery man and union representative. Rubin grew up in the then-upscale Avondale neighborhood of Cincinnati,Ohio. Jerry then decided to attend Cal- Berkeley in 1964 but dropped out to focus on social activism. Rubin organized the VDC (Vietnam Day Committee), led some of the first protests against the war in Vietnam, and was a cofounder of the Yippies (Youth International Party). He played an instrumental role in the disruption of the 1968 Democratic National Convention in Chicago.......Democrats....not Republicans, Frank. Rubin also emerged as a leader of the Bay Area's fledgling hippie and anti-war movements. After the Vietnam War ended, Rubin changed his political views and became an entrepreneur and businessman......how conventent!!!! By the '80s, he had decided that what he really wanted to get in touch with was money. He became a Wall Street marketing analyst and venture capitalist, using one of his specialities - hosting weekly ''networking salons'' to earn nearly $600,000 one year from people who paid $8 a head to swap business cards, he was con man. It was quite a change for someone who was once anti-establishment.....Rubin chased after dollars unapologetically. ''The individual who signs the check has the ultimate power,'' Rubin said in deflecting criticism that he had abandoned his '60s ideals. Bullshit!!!!.He had another agenda in the 60`s and 70`s He and his kind were scared shitless about going to war and the draft, he didn`t give shit about soldiers dying in Nam. It was all self serving.....same SOB`s that threw bags of shit at us, spit on us, and called us baby killers and losers......Over the years, I`ve watched people like Jerry, become VP`s and CEO`s and President and just plain rich, that protested the war. I remember a childhood friends, tell me "how tuff" it was on campus, dodging the tear gas......yea right......No Frank, you and I are not going to let ANYONE call these young men and women, baby killers and be spit upon......regardless of our politics and how we feel about this war. We SUPPORT these young men and women and respect them....I hardly see Cindy Sheehan in the same vain as Jerry Rubin. If anything, I find that in the leadership of our country, with the exception of Colin Powell, were more Jerry Rubin types. Myself, I supported going into Afgan, that`s where OBL was, and I wanted him dead......But Iraq.....I would have felt more apt to go into Saudi Arabia than Iraq....and "take out" the Royal Family....since OBL is a member of that clan and 15 of the 9/11 hijackers were from there. But I got a good idea why we didn`t, and I can pretty much guess the rest. Like I said, Frank, I just don`t think that people like you and I will EVER let the shit that went on in OUR era, happen to these soldiers.....And I say that with all due respect Frank.
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 15:22:06 (MDT)

LOL
Kim
USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 10:33:27 (MDT)

How did Tom Black get in there?
Frank Loveday
Bastrop, La. USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 10:26:16 (MDT)

Kim - Animal, I know & agree with most of what you are saying. Its just that I don't want to see what happened to us in Vietnam happen to our troops again now. They deserve the backing of the people back home & so did we. On high ground down in Louisiana waiting it out. Frank Sep69-Mar70.
Tom Black
USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 10:23:23 (MDT)

Jack Newton, the only name I came up with after thinking for the past week or so is Lundgren. Does anyone else from 69-70 remember if that was who crewed 027????Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 09:47:00 (MDT)

David Brook's op ed column in today's New York Times outlines a strategy in Iraq that I'd support. I'm not against the war, just the way we got in, the way it's being (not?) fought, and the lack of anything other than jingoism from our leaders! ....there have always been protesters during our country's wars. They haven't made a difference as long as people could understand, and trust, the rationale for fighting. A traitor, to me, is someone who travels to a country we're fighting, and tries to destroy the fighting will of the soldiers. Protest at home is not a traitorious act, it's exercising ones constitutional right. ....regarding getting 'their' constitution right, ours has been changed many times, I think that if our forefathers had waited until it was 'right' we'd still be waiting!!
Kim
Livermore, Me USA - Sunday, August 28, 2005 at 09:18:55 (MDT)

Robbie Thanks for trying on 027. Sir Izk
Jack Newton <SirIzk@centurytel.net>
Tomah, WI USA - Saturday, August 27, 2005 at 22:56:32 (MDT)

I respectfully disagree, Frank. President Bush works for Cindy Sheehan. She's merely asking for accountability, which is her right and duty. If the President is misleading the american people, he's the one aiding our enemies. Stay safe in the coming hurricane. Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Saturday, August 27, 2005 at 20:38:39 (MDT)

The First Amendment to our Constitution gives us the right to disagree with our Government BUT it does not give us the right to aid & abet the enemy & to undermine the morale of our men & women in uniform. It seems to me Vietnam Vets would especially understand this, we went through it. What is happening down in Crawford Texas is plain wrong. Clear to the RIGHT, clear to the LEFT, Im going to pull pitch & get out of here. Frank Sep69-Mar70.
Frank Loveday
Bastrop, La. USA - Saturday, August 27, 2005 at 13:32:53 (MDT)

Bill, as i told your son, i am proud of him & your family. God go with him & be with your oldest. Fred S. a very scary thing especially in the face of congress & their Military base closures. As one looks at History, Militarily we have been caught with our pants down a number of times & I don't think it would take much for North Korea to throw in their lot with those 2. If all those things were to come to pass, i think it would end with the Nuclear Subs & maybe ultimatly Armageddon. The best thing i feel i can do is give all the Moral support i can, let my congressmen/woman know how i feel & 1st & foremost have a good relationship with my God>>> May he bless us all in these times>> Smitty
jim westwang 71-72
sheridan, wy USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 21:08:06 (MDT)

Jeff, Heard the same thing. My son is a paratrooper with the 82nd at Ft Bragg and says he expects to be deployed around October/November.
Bill Wolf <VNHeloReunion@aol.com>
USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 14:27:20 (MDT)

Jim and Jeff, I`m getting worried about China and Russia, they are doing joint exercises and war games together.....they are practicing WAR as one unit. They mobilize together, and that`s 7 or 8 million soldier military force. That something to reckon with, Putin is former KGB, he`s "old school" Russia......Besides that Putin is "pulling back the reins" on democracy. China has been trying hack into the computers at the Pentagon and steal military secrets......Make no mistake, China wants Tiawan back.....that in itself will be a issue to contend with......with that in mind......we still got Iraq to deal with......and North Korea and Iran.....
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 13:05:44 (MDT)

Heard yesterday that more troops from 82nd are headed to Iraq. Increase in troop strength to around 160,000. Does this sound familiar or what? Maybe we could find a couple of Islamic clerics to imolate themselves for some more deja vu. Along with the rest of us I still support the troops!!!!
Jeff
USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 11:10:24 (MDT)

Well, i have been gone awhile again ( seeing what family i have left). Lots of great & stimulating commo in here since i last looked. You guys are great>> get me to thinking>> not one of my best attributes. I am glad that some folks have grounded convictions about Vietnam & Iraq. I am still not sure about all this & remain confused as i was in 1971, I became more jaded then than in 1969 when i first went. As far as Iraq becoming another Vietnam>> it may be. It seems as though we tried to fight & then install a different Government in Vietnam & it didn't work. We seem to be trying the same thing in Iraq. Definition of insanity is doing the same thing over & over again & expecting different results. That being said, I remain 100% behind our troops but i detest any War. Welcome home Scott>>> Prayers for those who are ill>>> Love & respects>>>> Smitty
jim westwang 71-72
sher, wy USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 10:53:01 (MDT)

Fred A, thanks for the heads up on the stickers. I wanted to get one or two for the helmet and truck. Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 08:19:04 (MDT)

Bernnie that was a nice commo on the ROK page. Does anybody have a pic of tiger wagon and and other pic s of ROKs???? send to me or post them on the page. bd431@mindspring .com Flight be careful out there
Rick England <`>
USA - Friday, August 26, 2005 at 07:40:50 (MDT)

ROBBIE...one more thing I forgot...in the email he ask for my mailing addy for stickers..I do believe that is in direct response to your posting.You,of course,would be first in line just in case he sends more than 2.If he only sends one..you will get it.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 22:36:30 (MDT)

dang,I forgot...he is trying to get the names of our kia's painted on before the next airshow.which is sept 10th.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 22:12:14 (MDT)

Freddy,I remember reading about that.It happened again with "vietnam vets against the war",in DC.At the last minute Nixon ( i believe) called off the cops...he didnt want a riot nor the bad "PR".
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 21:56:45 (MDT)

oh, the site is huey.co.uk....ok flight,Phil also sent me another pic,a very nice one,of "509' in a hover.I will send it on to those of you( and the e-mail) that i have contact points for.Please forward it on to those whose addy I dont have,or those that want it.Dave powers brought up a point i had missed,perhaps others will find something as well.Dave pointed out to me... the skid mount "T"s were painted either white or yellow,depending on which platoon a ship was in. Good eye Dave. KAL,how the heck you doing?
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 21:53:07 (MDT)

DON MILLER...I just recieved an e-mail from Phil.He states they are at the point where they are ready to paint our kia members on "509".I believe you are the leading expert in this area on this site, or for that matter,anyone I know of.If you dont mind,either we two or you and Phil need to get together,to get him the list of names.I would really love to put the ball in your court on this one.I know this is a labor of love and deep respect for you.I also respect your work in this area.I know you would be proud to be the one responsible for getting the names on our last flying bird.There is a point of contact on his site if you wish to go that route. Thanks buddy.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 21:44:07 (MDT)

It'd be fun to read the editorials, and news accounts, about the bonus army's removal from D.C. History has a way of correcting popular opinion, most of the time! I wonder how our little venture in nation building is going to look twenty years from now......Manny! The common wisdom is that he likes to go behind the wall on occasion to socialize, maybe a toke of ganja? that would explain his 'just Manny being Manny'episodes :>)) He's notorious for not signing autographs, so I was suprised to learn that he signed a tee shirt, the other day, of one of the players that I coach.....one more saying to add to the mix. The oppressor can make no rule that the oppressed are bound to respect. Eldridge Cleaver...to me, defending freedom is in the eye of the beholder. It bothers me that we have given up freedom, in the name of saving it! I think it's similar to the politician's teatment of the Japanese Americans in 1942. I bet the politicians were acting with the approval of a majority of Americans when they took away their freedom! Unfortunately, public opinion quite often leads to lynch mobs!
Kim
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 18:50:03 (MDT)

Brother Fred Alvis check this out.......VA benefits and history;...... About the Bonus Army...... A "shameful but little known 1932 police action," featured future Generals MacArthur, Patton and Eisenhower all playing a part in dealing with the so-called "Bonus Army" comprised of demonstrating World War I veterans, burning them out of their encampment of makeshift huts and tents on the mud flats by the Anacostia River outside of the beltway. Little is generally known about this extraordinary event in American history, one which quite directly let to FDR's huge election win in 1932... and all that followed!......... In 1924, a grateful U.S. government passed legislation that authorized the payment of cash bonuses to war veterans of World War I, adjusted for length of service. This was to make up for the wages the men had missed by serving in the army at only thirty dollars a month while others back home worked at high-paying wartime jobs. The bonus was due to be paid in 1945, however, the Crash of 1929 wiped out many veterans' savings and jobs, forcing them out into the streets. Groups of veterans began to organize and petition the government to pay them their cash bonus immediately, although veterans were within two years allowed to borrow money against the bonus. But because of the country-wide depression, in 1931 Congress expanded the privilege of borrowing with an amendment adopted over the veto of President Hoover, increasing the loan value of the certificates from 22.5% to 50% of face value. As a result of the opposition of President Hoover and numerous Senators and members of the House, due primarily to the fact that the country was trying to work it's way out of the depression and such an action would put a significant strain on the federal budget, a group of 300 veterans in Portland, Oregon organized by an ex-Sergeant named Walter Walters, decided to exercise their First Amendment rights by marching on Washington, D.C. to press their demands. Other veterans groups around the country rallied to the idea. In mid-June, when the Senate defeated the veteran-friendly bill passed by the House two days earlier, almost 20,000 veterans slowly shuffled up and down Pennsylvania Avenue for three days in a protest local newspapers titled the "Death March." Because President Hoover considered the Bonus Army Marchers a threat to public order and his personal safety in their marching and demonstrating, even though many of the Marchers left Washington after Congress adjourned, there were still over 10,000 angry, restless veterans in the streets. On 28 July 1932, two veterans were shot and killed by panicked policemen in a riot at the bottom of Capitol Hill. This provided the final stimulus. Hoover directed Secretary of War Patrick Hurley to tell then Army Chief of Staff General Douglas MacArthur that he wished the Bonus Army Marchers evicted from Washington. Troops from nearby Forts Myer and Washington were ordered in to remove the Bonus Army Marchers from the streets by force. One battalion from the 12th Infantry Regiment and two squadrons of the 3rd Cavalry Regiment (under the command of Major George S. Patton, who had taken over as second in command of the Regiment less than three weeks earlier) concentrated at the Ellipse just west of the White House. At 1600 hours the infantrymen donned gas masks and fixed bayonets, the cavalry drew sabers, and the whole force (followed by several light tanks) moved down Pennsylvania Avenue to clear it of people. Against the advice of his aide, Major Dwight D. Eisenhower, MacArthur had taken personal command of the operation. Hoover had ordered MacArthur to clear Pennsylvania Avenue only, but MacArthur immediately began to clear all of downtown Washington, herding the Marchers out and torching their huts and tents. Tear gas was used liberally and many bricks were thrown, but no shots were fired during the entire operation. By 2000 hours the downtown area had been cleared and the bridge across the Anacostia River, leading to the "Hooverville" where most of the Marchers lived, was blocked by several tanks. That evening Hoover sent duplicate orders via two officers to MacArthur forbidding him to cross the Anacostia to clear the Marchers' camp, but MacArthur flatly ignored the President's orders, saying that he was "too busy" and could "not be bothered by people coming down and pretending to bring orders." MacArthur crossed the Anacostia at 2300, routed the marchers along with 600 of their wives and children out of the camp, and burned it to the ground. Then, incredibly, he called a press conference at midnight where he praised Hoover for taking the responsibility for giving the order to clear the camp. He said, "Had the President not acted within 24 hours, he would have been faced with a very grave situation, which would have caused a real battle.... Had he waited another week, I believe the institutions of our government would have been threatened." Patrick Hurley, the Secretary of War, was present at this conference and praised MacArthur for his action in clearing the camp, even though he too was aware that Hoover had given directly contrary orders. It was this same sort of insubordination and manipulation that would lead to Truman summarily relieving MacArthur of his command of the UN forces in Korea in 1951. The last of the Bonus Army Marchers left Washington by the end of the following day. Hoover could not publicly disagree with his Chief of Staff and Secretary of War, and ended up paying the political cost of this incident. The possibility of widespread civil unrest growing into a popular revolution had been averted, but the forceful eviction of the Bonus Army Marchers (with over a thousand persons gassed), even though not one shot had been fired and only four people killed (the two demonstrators who had been shot by the police and two infants asphyxiated by tear gas), tilted public opinion against Hoover and ensured that he would lose the upcoming election. (News reports of the time were somewhat at variance with one another... one account had it that only an eleven month-old baby died and an eight-year-old lad was partially blinded.) The upshot was that it signaled the end for a group of WWI veterans who called themselves the Bonus Expeditionary Force, a pathetic finale for a group of citizens who had fought for our country, but who were cheated and then destroyed by the government.
Fred Skaggs
Summit , NJ USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 16:03:50 (MDT)

Thanks Rick
Jeff
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 12:58:04 (MDT)

I will be in the Pittsburg AO this Friday, Saturday, Sunday morning for my cusin's wedding. Anybody in that AO and want to hook up my POC will be my cell, (419-733-3154) or Holiday Inn at PGH South,Ft. Coud Rd. and Washington Blvd, Rt 19 Notrh. Inn's number is 412-833-5300. Will be leaving Coldwater Friday late noon, 6 hour ride and leaving Pittsburg Early Sunday morning. Just me and the "257". Anybody in that AO I will make to to have chow with or anything. God Bless and take care all................always a brother, Love you all....................
Mark
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 12:13:16 (MDT)

A Listing of all Korean Units in Vietnam This is the side bar and click on this then you see 1965-1972*******http://www.vietvet.co.kr This is were you get on the signon.
Rick England
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 11:48:56 (MDT)

FLIGHT; ran across a quote the other day that might be relevant"the man who would give up freedom for security deserves neither" don't remember who said it but sounded good to me.
paul mcgrath
oglesby, il USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 11:44:26 (MDT)

Rick E. You say "this is the side bar etc" Where is it? Did I miss something earlier in the log?
Jeff S.
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 11:27:55 (MDT)

A Listing of all Korean Units in Vietnam this is the side bar you go to for their logbook. Mr. Chung is sending me a Tiger Div. patch Maybe we can get more. If anybodyis intrested. 1965-1972***** You can post pics of their what they call the free board to post. Be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Thursday, August 25, 2005 at 04:23:55 (MDT)

get ready boys and girls.....christmas is in 16 weeks
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 22:32:01 (MDT)

I read a bit of something today.The time frame is during the vietnam war,but it continues to strike chords today.Its about the meaning and value of patriotism.It ask patriotisn's hardest questions.I paraphrase in the intrest of my poor typing (and spelling) skills....Should love of country be unqualified or conditional? Should it require loyalty to a governments policies whatever they are,or welcome dissent based on allegiance to a nations highest principles? Or is it enough to be faithful to individual or universal values?In what ways might patriotism be a force for good or inspire noble sacriface,and when does it become a club for stifling dissent and a rallying cry for unjustifiable destruction?When I was young,I had answers,or so I thought at the time.As i have matured during my trip down lifes road,I now think my answers have changed,or perhaps,a bit more conditional.I also now know,I dont know crap.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 22:02:45 (MDT)

Fred S. I am well aware of your feelings towards the Yankees. I just thought since you have moved closer you may have had a change of heart. I must remain faithful. What else would one expect from one who has sat on Mel Allens'lap. Even have his autograph on my old ball.
Jeff
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 20:19:05 (MDT)

Kim "Coach" LaVoie, why did Manny run through the outfield fence wall? I love Manny from his Cleveland days......He`s a adventure in the outfield anyway......make a great catch. Then drop a routine fly ball......He`s "natural born hitter" without a doubt. BTW...Jeff S......I`m a "Yankee Hater", dating back to 1961, when they beat my beloved Frank Robinson and the Cincy Reds......
Fred Skaggs
Summit , NJ USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 19:35:50 (MDT)

Scott, DEROS was a term used to denote when we left RVN for 'the world'..date expected to return from over seas. Sorry I never got to meet your dad, he must have left about the same time I arrived at Lane. As I said earlier, as enlisted folk, we didn't have a whole lot of say as to where we went. Flying was voluntary, but, we had 67N's who worked in the motor pool,drove trucks, climbed telephone poles......being a bastard unit, MOS meant next to nothing! Glad you got back in one piece......watching the LL world series, there's a lot of great play, too much comparison to the big leagues though. It's fun to watch the camera pan across the dugout and take in the kids, just being kids :>))
Kim
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 19:21:58 (MDT)

Scott, as they say here in Jersey.....fuhgeddaboudit. I should know your dad, I was with 129th at that same time period and lived next door to the Cobra Platoon Hooch. Jeff....University president Nancy Zimpher,came to U. of Cincinnati in 2003 from Wisconsin-Milwaukee.....those Wisconsin ladies just don`t like smartass Ohio guys....LOL.....Larry Huggins, Bob`s younger brother played BB for OSU, when Bob was a asst. coach at OSU in 1979. They would give BB clinics in the summer for Parks and Rec. That`s where I got acquainted with the Huggins boys. And Bobby liked his beer.....
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 19:07:44 (MDT)

Flight: Wink good to see you post. What a group of Brothers. No matter what opinions you may have. I love you all. Scott, once your around enough. You realize we all have our opinions and are not afraid to express them. But, I wouldn't trade off any of them. And I know if I needed someone to cover my rear. I could count on any of these Brothers to back me up. Alvis how is Susan doing? You got a wonderful Woman there. Well, will clear left and get out. Tommorrow is another day at the ZONE. At least until next Monday. Day off at the VA. Just keep trying!!! Getting my medication is a relief. Always A Brother Alex
Alex
Collierville, TN USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 19:00:34 (MDT)

I must have double clickitis or something!!!!!!!
Guess
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 17:55:06 (MDT)

Freddie, My wife and neighbor, both UofC people, think the pres of the institution does not quite understand that sports and better yet winning sports teams are who butter the financial bread. Although I am a hardcore Tarheel, you know, the present national champions, I follow the Bearcats thru marriage.(Read: Because my wife tells me to) They a a good b-ball team and don't need this kind of distractions this close to the season. Go figure! Can you tell me why Manny went thru the door in the Green Monster during the game? I only caught a clip of it on ESPN and did not get the audio. Kind of strange time to take a stadium tour. See ya. Don't ever worry about where I stand. You cleared my tail rotor enough times that it sould not be in doubt. Say hello to Kim for us.
Jeff
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 17:52:34 (MDT)

I should really revise my comment that my dad "loved his time with the unit." I'm sure he hated just about everything that had to do with being away from his beloved central Wisconsin woods, his bow, and fly reel. However, with that said, what I meant by the comment was that since he was there anyway, at least he was able to do something he always wanted to do...fly. When I reread it I realized that it sounded a little callous. On that same note, would you believe I once had a battalion commander who, while addressing our BN before deployment, made the statement "For those of you who were lucky enough to serve in Vietnam, your experience will be needed." When he made the statement I was in formation right next to a senior NCO who served as a crew chief with the 101st in Vietnam. I thought I was going to have to peform CPR on the poor guy because he just about fell over when he heard that. Much to my amusement he started laughing out loud at the commander's comment right there in formation.
Scott Kniprath <scott.kniprath@charter.net>
Eau Claire, WI USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 17:06:55 (MDT)

Jeff S.....Yankees are only 3 games out....Kim L. and I was talking about that earlier....Yankees have had some key injuries and they are well and coming back. I`m still upset about U. of Cincinnati firing Bobby Huggins (basketball coach), this close to school starting. BTW......Thanks Jeff....
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 17:02:41 (MDT)

Well...I guess I stirred up a genuine hornets nest of ideas and feelings here. So much was written since my comment last night that I don't really know where to begin. First, because this is the most important; to Fred Skaggs, if in your opinion my words in ANY WAY trashed your or Alvis' character I SINCERELY apologize. I reread my comments from last night and I honestly don't know where I did any trashing as that was in no way my intent. If you want to identify what you deemed as trashing I will try to clarify. I simply read some vets voicing their opinions about the service of youth, and as I am "sort of" young (my little boy makes me feel older every day) :-) I thought I would step in with my personal point of view. That's all...I didn't want to get political, assasinate character, or trash anyone. This sounds hoaky, but I have such a sincere respect and love for our Vietnam Veterans that I get teary-eyed when I think about the you-know-what sandwich you have been dealt. I truly mean that...so again, I'm sorry if my words offended, I took no offense from yours. Second, to blanket the whole Cindy Sheehan issue, I absolutely acknowledge her right to do what she is doing. I really didn't want to get into it because I can only imagine the pain she is going through, my heart goes out to her because now that I have a child, I think I would go insane if anything ever happened to him. My issue is this: First, I feel her grief and enormous sacrifice is being manipulated by those with a political agenda and by those who have sacrificed nothing. That saddens me deeply. Second, I wish her dissent was done in a more constructive manner and one which did not embolden our enemy, which I believe hers does. Third, I absolutely agree that the mistreatment of our veterans is a bona fide fact. No question, my point was that governments in general, by their nature, screw up everything they touch and the treatment of veterans will be no exception. It is sad but true, thus my opinion of hoping for the best, expect the worst...Fourth, Fred, as a strict constitutionalist I actually agree with you about formal declarations of war. I think that should have been done NLT September 12th, 2001. Also, I don't have a problem with all of academia, I had some wonderful instructors. However, I also had some horrible ones who would abuse their duties by turning a general course in economics into a political diatribe about how "terrible of a nation America is." Kim, I'm not familiar with the DEROS acronym? I believe my dad left country in April '71. He served in Vietnam for about 15 months but was not with the 129th for the entire tour...maybe the last 5 months or so? He was drafted as an engineer but, as describes it, "got sick of being shot at and wanted to shoot back" so he transferred to aviation. He had always wanted to fly so it was a good fit. I know he loved his time with the unit. As for the Agent Orange statement, I don't think he ever discussed it like it was a "regular" thing. I just remember him getting wierd rashes sometimes seemingly out of nowhere and he would wonder in passing if there was some long term affects from the war because he recalled flying a few of those missions. Finally guys, I just want to say that I appreciate you welcoming me. Quite frankly, I hardly feel worthy...all I did in the Middle East was as we say "fix green helicopters." I have a crew chief/mechanic MOS but couldn't get a flight slot in time for our deployment. You guys flew so hard, and so bravely, the only unit today that could begin to match your experience is probably the 160th SOAR. It's nothing against the rest of modern Army Aviation (of which I'm proudly apart) it's just that the context of warfare has changed so drastically. Anyway. I hope I addressed some of your comments.
Scott Kniprath <scott.kniprath@charter.net>
Eau Claire , WI USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 16:54:13 (MDT)

I forgot to mention the 1971 Time mag with cover picture of a Dustoff leaving an LZ in Laos during 719. If a picture is worth a 1000 words this one more than summed up the fighting ARVN adventure to that country. Pic is of aircraft leaving LZ with uninjured ARVN hanging off both skids. I know the AC of that aircraft (we served together in Germany) and he said it was a common occurance that got so bad the crews had to grease the skids so they couldn't get a grip.
Jeff
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 16:14:20 (MDT)

Interested in LS 719? Read "Price Of Exit". Good info . Written by a WO whose name escapes me. Also describes actions in and around An Khe as 4th ID was standing down. Mentions many places most of us have had the pleasure of visiting. BTW-Well said Fred S!!! And also to Freddie---- GO YANKEES!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jeff
Lake Norman, NC USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 16:08:36 (MDT)

Our own Rick "Rebel" Smith was in Lam Son 719. He was with the 7/17 Cav before the 129th. We lost a friend from flight school in that action. My roomate, James B. Low, who was riding in the front seat of a Cobra assaulting a .50 cal.when they were shot down. Rick visited him in the hospital before he died, and his description of our friend haunts me still today. God bless, Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 14:22:59 (MDT)

Alvis, 71 is the right date for Lam Son 719. The idea was to demonstrate the Vietnamese Army's ability to conduct large scale operations, independent of Their allies! Unfortunately, what was demonstrated was their inability to do so. The common wisdom is that they would have been able to hold thier own, as long as we supplied tac air for them. To my was of thinking, the last big time fight for American helicopters was in early 72, when tne NVA tried again to cut the country in half by coming through the central highlands. They did make some inroads with their diversionary strike, up north, a little item neglected during the 'great treaty' which ended American involvment! Scott, when did your dad DEROS? I served in the Cobra's from mid 71 till December, and can't place him. Probably a case of CRS............One thing I do know, as enlisted folks, we did'nt get the chance to decide where we would serve. We just allowed ourselves to become the weapons of the politicians. I think our oath stated we agreed to defend the Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and domestic. As a civilian, I do have to right to decide where and when I'll fight, protest, agree, disagree, work for, or work for the removal of whatever candidate I choose......I don't like boy georgie, never have, probably never will. To me, his very existence as a politician is an affront to what I served for in Vietnam. I will go to great lengths to believe the worst about him, his policies, the condition of our standing in the world community, and the future harvest of such a poorly sown crop of jingoism.....I didn't serve in Vietnam just to protect georgie boys' right to dodge serving and use his daddy's influence to enrich himself, I also served so that any one can speak their minds on any issue, whether I agree with their opinion or not. If this debacle is going to turn on one grieving mother, it says something about the validity of the fight....Alex, good luck with our friends at the VA. Alvis, glad things have turned around for your wife, hope things are continuing to improve......guess I can't recall having to fly any agent orange missions..my good luck,:>))
Kim
Livermore, Me USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 14:08:47 (MDT)

Fred A., Until this morning, my focus was on gas prices.....so I know the war is not all about oil. And I got a little worried about Pat Robertson getting ready to "throw down" with, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez. That`s all we need, another 10% cut in our oil imports.
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 12:01:11 (MDT)

Its the damn networks that keep Cindy,and her kind, in our faces everyday.She isnt big news,in my opinion,just an unfortunate mother among to many other unfortunet mothers.She has said her piece,now the networks need to focus on other things.The networks are so blantently anti war/bush that they too are using her,just as they do michial moore( the fat pig that he is).There are a few examples of folks deriding troops returning home,but they are few and far between.I would be arrested for assault to come upon someone calling returning troops baby killers,but folks have the right to protest the war and anymore, I am not so sure they are entirly wrong.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 10:58:39 (MDT)

Man.............heavy stuff going on in here.........good stuff though.....lefties, righties, front seat, back seat..........as I once stated here. "Don't matter". The wise man and fool, the rich man and the poor, all face the same fate. Not that I don't read all the comments here with heart felt respect and graditude. All of you know why and where I am coming from. There will always be young soldiers ordered off to war. Be it just or unjust. Hang on though, because someday there will be no more wars. Trust me on this. It will all boil down to whether we live forever, or burn...........WELCOME HOME Scott..........and thanks to your Pop and the rest of these guys. You have all shaped me into the person I am today......Have I told you that I loved you all today.......always a brother................
Mark
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 10:51:50 (MDT)

i'm not sure i should wade into this but here goes. therre is one thing one should know about cindy sheenan. she has hated this country for may years, 0only her husband an son kept her in check.i have heard the hate she holds for our country from her mouth on many news clips from her mouth.she lost her son in the war. for that i feel for her.she also sat with the president, an after the sit down she stated that the president was an honorable man an she respected him. if she disagreed with with president policies or any part of why didn't say something than.now she is demanding another meeting with the president, why i ask you.she has alined herself with michael moore an his kind, which i might add are using her,only to make our president an this country look bad.if sheenandisagreed so strongly about the war why did she wait until her son lost his life for his country?my opinion is she is using the lose of her son to put her in the spot lightan if any one thinks i'm wrong just go to michael moores wed site, don't take my word for it. she a disgrees to the death of her son and another who made the decison to join the service of this country an to DIE FOR IT. gentleman she is know better than jane fonda,do you all remember how we wre treated when we came home from veit nam an how the country made us feel. well if we as verterans of nam don't want another generation to go through than this country better smartin up.we have enough lost souls an we don't need anymore.this is like veit nam in that at this point right or wrong and what ever our feelings are about the war we must stand behind our troops 100%. they need this surport, as we all well know. i am proud to know that thier still young men an women out there willing to give there lives for us an our country. sheeman as well as fonda hate this country an the emeny plays on this. so we as a people must think of what our actions will do to the moral to our fighting soldiers.we as veit nam vet know this frist hand. i've said what i had to say an stand by it. wink 3/69-10/70
wink
lake wales, fl USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 09:33:58 (MDT)

sorry,that should read 1972,not 1971
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 09:06:31 (MDT)

I was just doing some reading about the last "big battle" of vietnam,the one we were involved in anyway( we as in american choppers).It happened in march of 71 and was code named lamson 719.It was an attempt to block the trail by invading laos.Ground forces were ARVIn,us troops couldnt be involved....except helicopters and bombers.The attack was just west of Khe Sanh,trying to capture a town about 20 miles inside Laos.The fight started march 8th and went till march 24th.Facing us(nva and pathot loa) were 22,000 troops,13,000 who were combat troops.On our side,flying out of Khe Sanh,the helicopter units included ( to give you some idea of the aircraft involved) the Kingsmen,toros,blue max,commancheros,black widows,dolphines,phoenix,lancers,hawks,ghostriders and redskins.All were army units,either slicks,or gunships.Heavy lift helicopters,observeation ships,matine choppers and so on made more.There were,of course,fast movers involved as well.No americans were on the ground there,unless shot down of course,but somehow over 200 americans were killed there,almost all helicopter crewmen.The first helicopter lost substained heavy damnage and had been clawing its way back toward khe Sanh when the tail boom seperated and it went in.On one of the first CA,s the first chanook in erupted in a ball of fire from antiaircraft fire.all lost.second one in was heavly damnaged.In one day,march 21st,fighting was so heavy,there was 11 arch light missions (B-52s),270 fighter bomber sorties and 1,388 helicopter gunship sorties.By march 24th,when the arvns were pulled out,over 700 helicopters had substained heavy damnage....more than the number of helicopters at the start of the campaign.A full 10% of the choppers lost in nam happened in this 2 week battle.The arvns and nixon called this a great victory.A full 1/3rd of the arvin units were kia,s,some units suffering 50% rates.hanio also called it a great victory.At no time did the fighting shut down the trail.who was lying? both? either?The high command decreed helicopters fly at above 3,000 feet,as they had been flying low level.Thats when nva antiaircraft fire ( including sam missles) started.after a few days,low level resumed.Experts have stated that no army on earth,at that time,could have taken the objectives but forth at the start of the campaign.Oh,did nixons re-election campaign have anything to do with this?
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 09:02:30 (MDT)

welcome home scott and thanks for your continuing service. wink 3/69-10/70
wink
lake, fl USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 08:47:49 (MDT)

Ray,good to see you post.Thanks for the remimder.Kal,please keep us posted on how your doing.We are concerned.Alex, you too brother. Don,I am still trying to get Phil to paint our kia,s names on his helicopter. I know this is something close to your heart and you are probably the authority in here on that subject,as your web site shows.Hopefully,at some point,we can get you to together in corespondence.Animal,always good to see you post,the logic and resoning of you "lefties" is always hard to refute,has it carries much logic along with truths.Bill,has your son reported for basic yet? Scott,I too forgot,forgive me, welcome home.Your dad did indeed cover our butts and we are grateful.Gunships were full of crazies,chuckle,they had to be.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 08:08:10 (MDT)

WELCOME HOME SCOTT
ALEX
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 07:51:05 (MDT)

Flight: Been awol for a while. Still don't have a manager as of yet. So, I am working a 60 hour plus week. Plus found out yesterday that I re-factured my left foot again. So the Doctor is running all kinds of blood work. Monday to the VA for the ringing in my ears. Then on Sept.5th have a PTSD appointment. Should be interesting. Scott I agree with you on most of your comments. For unseen reasons we fail to read all whats being said. Or read what we want to read. We all have seen combat. And the reason whether being drafted or joining the military doesn't matter. We need to respect and honor our Brothers no matter what war or conflict they sereved!! Now Scott I will disagree about Cindy. She is a Gold Star Mother. She has my respect. We don't how we would react if our children that were killed in a war or conflict. Let't try to understand her feelings. Who is to say she is right or wrong. Scott, as you stated. We all fought and some gave it all so, American's have the right to protest or express their view. In closing my Brother and Sisters. Were all proud to be an American. Always A Brother Alex
Alex
Collierville , TN USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 07:49:42 (MDT)

Well said, Scott... thanks. I am glad to hear your opinion, and it does us all good to hear your generation's take on things. There truly is more at risk here than losing your stereo system or CD collection. I believe there are a lot of folks in this country who honestly don't understand what this conflict is about. Oil? Come on... what happened on 9/11? This country really does have enemies, and most of them don't live here. Wars are won when there is unity of purpose. Aid and comfort to the enemy doesn't help the cause, and only adds weapons to his arsenal. I also join Animal in thanking your dad... without his service many of us wouldn't be here to voice our opinions! And if it weren't for folks who believe in the good of this country we wouldn't have the freedom to speak here as we do.
Dave Powers
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 07:36:51 (MDT)

I almost forgot.....WELCOME HOME,Mr.Kniprath
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 07:31:04 (MDT)

Good Morning Mr.Kniprath, obviously academia has been good to you. You articulated you case and points quite well, so give them(academians) some credit......Brother Alvis and Brother Animal(Greg), thank you so much for eloquently stating and defending "who we are". I`m sure Brother Kim LaVoie, will have something to say also......Make no mistake, Mr.Kniprath, we ARE Brothers-In-Arms and the 129th Assault Helicopter Company as long as God gives us breath......... I support our troops but oppose war with Iraq or any other nation that does not pose a clear and present danger to our people and nation, such as N.Korea. Until and unless the current U.S. Administration provides evidence which clearly demonstrates that Iraq or any other nation poses a clear, direct and immediate danger to our country, I oppose all of this Administration's pre-emptive and unilateral military activities in Iraq. Furthermore, I cannot support any war that is initiated without a formal Declaration of War by Congress, as our Constitution requires. That`s a lesson I learned in Viet-Nam Although I detested the dictatorial policies of Saddam Hussein and sympathized with the tragic plight of the Iraqi people, I opposed unilateral and pre-emptive U.S. military intervention on the grounds that it established a dangerous precedent in the conduct of international affairs, that it could easily lead to an increase of violent regional instability and the spread of much wider conflicts, that it places needless and unacceptable financial burdens on the American people, that it diverts us from addressing critical domestic priorities(VA Benefits), and that it distracts us from our goals of tracking down and destroying international terrorists and their lairs. Furthermore, I do not believe that the American military can or should be used as the police force of the world by any administration, Republican or Democrat. Consequently, I believe that the lives and well being of our nation's soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines should not be squandered or sacrificed for causes other than in the direct defense of our people and nation. Finally, I believe that a doctrine of pre-emptive and unilateral U.S. military attack on Iraq or any other nation is illegal, unnecessary, counter-productive and presents a truly dire and distressing threat to our vital international interests and basic national security. As a Viet-Nam veteran, I have a unique understanding of war and know the many hidden truths that lie behind war's easy theories and promises, as well as behind the tragic consequences that even, "victory" brings. We therefore I support Cindy Sheehan in her efforts to help avert, mitigate or stop a national tragedy and an international calamity. After serving in Viet-Nam, I believe our troops should never be placed in harm's way except to meet and defeat any direct and immediate threat to our people........Now your father`s time in the 129th is more than honorable, but I take exception of unnecessary trashing of Brother Alvis and myself character for stating our observations and feelings, this offends me the most. As in Viet-Nam, Brother Alvis and myself and other brothers, we WILL respond.....As group, We stopped taking shit from ANYONE.....a LONG time ago.......BTW...My personal statement about,"stereo and CD collection", as 19 year old in Nam, after a 12 or 14 hour day of flying.......My mission in life was to get back to An Son and listen to my stereo and albums.....That meant one more day I had "beat the odds" and was alive.........
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 07:26:51 (MDT)

HELLO TO ALL MY SISTERS AND BROTHERS JUST CAME IN TO SAY HI, STILL WAITING FOR THE CONE MARELL TEST TP COME BACK, TODAY I SEE THE NEROULIGIS,I SILL GET MIXED UP BUT I GUES WE ALL DO. KALHOW ARE YOU FEELING. RICK THAKS FOR THE CALL. ROB I CALL YOU SOON AND I WISH YOU ALL THE BEST OH I CALLED BUD RAINEY TOLD HIM ABOUT THE DVE BILL MADE ASKED IF LIKE TO SEE IT, SAID HE LOVE TO SO I GAVE HIM MY CD.I THINK IT MAY HELP HIM I THINK BILL SAID HE GET ME ANOTHER IF HE CANT THATS OK BUT I REALY THINK BUT SOULD HAVE A COPY, I AM GOING TO ASK BILL TO ONE OF US AT THE REUION,,MARK AND DEE TAKE CARE. A BROTHER ALWAYS LOVE YOU ALL MY FRIENDS RAY
RAY
MD USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 07:17:51 (MDT)

What the heck you been smoking? No-one questions why people serve...there are many reasons and most are NOT pure patiroitism.The question that was put forth was why youth and not old farts,are desired.The answer is > old folks are set in their ways,while youth and their minds are still malable.Basic training is not only aimed toward firming the body,which plays no small role ,but the biggest training ,the true aim,is the mind.That is a simple statement,not a condemation.It must be that way.The last true wave of enlistments for "pure patoirtism" was most likely WW 2. Another thing,the mistreatment of veterans is a bona fide fact.Perhaps the word mistreatment should be replaced with the word"untreatment" OR UNDERtreatment.Vietnam veterans have been put on the "back burner"( for claims) so they can treat iraq vets.Thats another bona fide fact.Its easy to enspouse how great the treatment is when you are in front of the line.Scroll back thru the years this site has been here...you will see a common thread posted by guys trying to get help..which most have finally gotten.The VA hospitials are over crowed and over worked,but yet,they still do a wonderful job..its the stinking bean counters most comments are aimed at.Fighting for democracy? take a good look around at the folks we suport,very few fall into that discription.While I lean towards the "right",I am becomming aware of the merit in the statements made from our left leaning brothers in here..Kim,fred S.animal,gently and others.We enjoy a discourse,with out malice nor hard feeling.Not once,not one single time,EVER,has anyone in here NOT been 100% behind our troops.Most statements in here are the reasoning behind sending another generation for questionable goals or basis for invasion in the first place.WE have paid the asking price of the brotherhood,as you,and others of your generation now have.You will find acceptance here,but your statements may be questioned,as many of mine are,as you have done in a most mannerly way.My assesment on VA comes from my past 33 years experience interacting with them.Give them time,they will screw you guys too.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 05:47:55 (MDT)

Scott, Thanks for your comments, and thanks for serving. I admire and respect the patriotism of our servicemen and women today. But I also respect and admire those who speak and act out for things they truely believe in. That's what our forefathers did. You've got to keep in mind,however, that in the eyes of the status quo, our forefathers were traitors and terrorists. It's a good thing we won the revolution! I truely love this country for it's diversity and openess to opposing ideas. To me, a person is unpatriotic by NOT expressing their beliefs. Without debate, freedom would slowly rust away like an old hemi(sorry guys). In my humble opinion, Cindy Sheehan would be a patriot even without her son's sacrifice. It's the millions of americans who go about their day unconcerned one way or the other that have earned my contempt. Anyway, don't be a stranger here, Scott, you belong. And thank your Pop for covering my ass in '71.
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Wednesday, August 24, 2005 at 00:37:06 (MDT)

Couple things...first, to all you Vietnam vets out there, thanks for your service. I know it is cliche, but I sincerely mean it. Rarely does a day go by when I don't think of you guys and your service. Second, my father served in the 129th as a gunner with the Cobras in '71 and throughout my childhood, indeed to this day, he has been and remains my biggest hero. His service inspired my love for Army Aviation and was a central factor in my decision to enlist. It is also because of his affiliation with your unit that I check in here every so often. With that said, and with the utmost respect for the sacrifices of all Vietnam veterans, a sacrifice that I cannot comprehend (the most any crewmember flew in our tour in Iraq was a few hundred hours), I must respond to the theories advanced by Fred Skaggs and Alvis regarding the youth who serve our country, the "never ending fight" for democracy, and the mistreatment of veterans by our government. Gentlemen, please do not question why we serve today, for to do so casts upon us the very same stigma that was cast upon you. As an all volunteer force, we serve because, well aware of the consequences, we enlisted. Second, we serve because we love our country, we cherish freedom, and because we believe that freedom is threatened. Just like, despite what years of propaganda has told the American people, freedom was threatened by communist expansion during your service. Nothing annoys me greater than to hear some academic announce that the Vietnam War was fought for nothing, as though that statement is fact. On the contrary, you were fighting for something. Never, ever forget that. As for me Mr. Skaggs, I do have more to fight for than just my stereo and CD collection. As a patriot, I have the liberty given to me by the blood of countless generations of American veteran's to fight for. And, while viewed as individual sacrifices that blood may seem wasted, it is because of the constant, continuous struggle that it represents that our precious Liberty still exists today. In 1776, more than half of the would-be Americans felt that we were going to fight for nothing. Yes, it is true that there will always be a "never ending fight for democracy." But that is because God gave man the gift of free-will; and as long as man is around to make the choice, some will choose the mindless simplicity of tyranny while others will choose Freedom. I choose Freedom. And that is why I served. My friends, the Americans who thought the Revolution was useless were wrong, and so is Cindy Sheehan. As a twenty-seven year old father of a beautiful five month old baby boy, my heart truly aches for her loss, but her actions remain unforgivable all the same. She is dishonoring her son, his heroism, her family, and she is only fueling the fires of the enemy. Finally, as for the mistreatment of veterans by our government. I sympathize for you generation. My dad flew gun ship missions and tells stories of flying escort missions under the aircraft spraying agent orange. Fortunately, he has never had serious symptoms. All I can say is that this nation is great not because of government, but because of people. To expect anything from the government is folly. Hope for the best, expect the least, and drive on making everything out of life that you as an individual can. I will say; however, that as a veteran myself I have found the government's treatment to be stellar. I will also say that, while it is true the VA does have many serious issues, it is has also put countless millions of veterans and servicemembers through college, into homes, and generally on a better, more focused road in life. Again gentlemen, while I must respectfully disagree with your take on the current state of affairs in our nation, I sincerely thank you for your sacrifice and I think of you always. Sincerely, Scott L. Kniprath PS: While in the Middle East I had the distinct pleasure of serving with one Vietnam Vet pilot from the 1st Avn Bgde and a Vietnam Vet crew chief (still crewing after all these years). It was a great honor.
Scott L. Kniprath <scott.kniprath@charter.net>
Eau Claire, WI USA - Tuesday, August 23, 2005 at 23:46:16 (MDT)

Robbie, sorry Bro. too many years have passed. I don't remember that many names anymore. Later, Don
Don Miller
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Tuesday, August 23, 2005 at 19:54:46 (MDT)

027 was the first ship I flew on at 129th. The crew chief was a tall lanky guy with a lot of pimples. I've been trying to think of his name for a few days now before posting but still can't remember it. He never told me I was supposed to clear that side of the ship for the pilots before we took off. I remember he was yelling like crazy at me while we were flying and I didn't know why. When he got a chance he came over and told me. Larry Jackson took me on as his gunner after a few days, and I learned from him. Bill Wolf might remember That crew chief's name or maybe Pete Rhome would or Bud Rainey. How about you Don Miller? you were there when I was. Do you remember him? Anyway, SirIzik that's all I can remember about 027. Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Tuesday, August 23, 2005 at 12:22:25 (MDT)

I just found the Tiger Div. site yahooo http://www.polkcounty.org/vn/VN/vietnam.html check it out I signed and gave our page addy. its in english and Korean they have reunions also I would rather do that that go to VN. It has pics and info about qui Nhon and headquarters
Rick England
USA - Tuesday, August 23, 2005 at 07:46:25 (MDT)

I don`t know about luck Fred......All the money I spent trying to hit those numbers.....The lottery still has the advantage on me....
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Monday, August 22, 2005 at 06:19:44 (MDT)

fredy,luck has been with you.I never hit for a single cent.Now, if I can just hit the big one....
alvis
USA - Monday, August 22, 2005 at 04:27:39 (MDT)

Fred A........That`s wild....I played 322, 495, 664, on the Pick 3 Ohio Lottery.... and won on all three numbers at separate times ......most I won was $1700 on 495......What`s so ironic about that is, Ron DeBates was the crewchief on 495, and Ron loved to gamble.
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Sunday, August 21, 2005 at 20:35:57 (MDT)

I was there in 71 and could swear I flew on that ship.I dont know why,but those numbers stuck in my head for all these years.For many years, I thought it was the one gabby was flying,but I ran into the crewchief ( on gabbys ship during that incident)in DC a few years back and he told me it wasnt.Anyway,those numbers stuck in my head so hard,that for years i played the lotto using those 3 numbers.Thats one answer i would really like to see posted in here.
alvis
USA - Sunday, August 21, 2005 at 19:48:07 (MDT)

Hey flight: Does anyone remember helicopter UH-1H, tail number 66-16027 ??? I came across a photo of it sitting on the flight line rigged for air evac to 79th Trans in Quin Hon.The helicopter information sheet in the 129th only lists time it was in 17th Cav.No mention of accident summary when it was in 129th. Arrived 129th Jun 1968, crashed Mar 1970. Anyone know crew and/or how it crashed ??. I know it's been a long time but hope someone remembers. Thanks, (SirIzk) Newton
Jack Newton <SirIzk@centurytel.net>
Tomah, WI USA - Sunday, August 21, 2005 at 15:37:14 (MDT)

Thank you flame.Its always good to hear about another brother.Its great he is still flying.
alvis
USA - Saturday, August 20, 2005 at 20:19:49 (MDT)

Charlie Hugget was my assistant platoon leader. He was in first platoon. I was in 129th from dec 70 to april 71. We took rounds northwest of Pleiku early in 71. He kept oone of the rounds out of fuel tank. It was always "o dark hundred" to him for departure time. Talked with him about a year ago on phone. Told him about our site but neveer heard from him again. Think he leans mo9re to the VNHPA side of things. Was a good shit. He did say he flew a hospital helo. Glad no one was hurt.
Flame
woonsockert, sd USA - Saturday, August 20, 2005 at 15:33:50 (MDT)

Jack Newton, I was the final door gunner on 465. We crashed it on a resupply mission in June 1969. Peter Pilot (Mike Solar) lost part of his leg in that crash. AC was WO Rau. Some people thought I jumped out of the ship when it crashed, but I rode down the mountain for 3 full turns and then grabbed bushes when it rolled over and they pulled me out over the 60. I have pictures of it sitting in Qui Nhon after the crash if you'd like to see them. Beebee was my crew chief at the time, and I was to inherit that ship to crew because Beebee was going to stop flying and go into maint. Beebee wouldn't fly after that because he had a few crashes before this one and thought he was accident prone. Why were you asking about it?????Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 15:26:51 (MDT)

Reference helicopter UH-1H tail number 67-17465. If I remember right this was SP5 Rodney Bebee's bird. Does anyone have any info.
Jack Newton <SirIzk@centurytel.net>
Tomah, WI USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 10:23:17 (MDT)

Animal, that's affirmative. Thor says, "His call sign was "Da Hunter". He always used to put a flag with his call sign on it on top of the bunker outside his hooch when he went out on a mission. Flag flying - he's flying, no flag, he's on the ground. He was in first flight platoon too. First lewie and made O-3 while I was there if memory serves."
Dave Powers
USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 09:49:22 (MDT)

oh,one more thing.....get your affairs in order boys...I saw a statistic the other day ( no proff was offered along with it) that the average age of death for a vietnam veteran is 62.
alvis
USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 08:12:52 (MDT)

because their minds are alot more open than ours.Their eaiser to "mold".Vietnam verterans ,vietnam era veterans,hell,all veterans,simple cannot "get it together" to form large voting blocks,ot to form public opinion possitive towards the plight of veterans.All they ever hear is the "B.S." the veterans admin.propaganda mill churns out.sample...They tell facts such " We have increased VA budgit spending by 10%".Thats great news of th face of it.The skewed fact of the mater is what they dont tell you.Increased spending of 10% BUT,service demands,ie case loads,ie folks wanting help,have increased 20%.They pat each other on the back,smile for the cameras,and say what a good job they are doing,and the public believes it.The true cost of the vietnam war,and any other war, has been the impact on veterans lives,including their families.Sucides,drunkiness,homelessness,drug addiction,ptsd,unfounded anger,withdrawel from society,it takes many forms to wreck a life,a familys life,a sorry assed lifestyle.Many of us retreat into ourselves,working every day,or existing without outward problems,disfuctional as hell.The flag went up,the bugle sounded,we answered.Most countries ON EARTH ,take care of their war veterans,here we are called cry babies,lazy shits looking for a handout,welfare wannabes.Name me 10 people,who were changed for the better because of war,,,,and I am talking combat veterans,not Siagon mail clerks.People entering into the VA system today HAVE to meet certian finicial requirements and STILL HAVE to wait over a year to get a primary care doctor. No,the system isnt perfect and its the best thing WE have going....but that just doesnt say a hell of alot does it? Like the old saying//We were sprayed AND betrayed.It still rings true today.The american goverenment,as far as veterans treatment is concerened,is a sorry assed example of our goverenment at work.As I said before...look around at other countries and their treatment of their war veterans...ours is a sad,sad,statement.
alvis
USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 08:06:50 (MDT)

Jack I remember the incident but don't remember the rest. The guy that took his place died and Bob hiedenreich also died from agent orange.
Rick England
USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 07:00:30 (MDT)

Mark......I`m a "cold pizza" and milk" kinda guy.....I`ll munch that to death......Fred Alvis....the VA will use every means to deny us any type of disability.....And we`ll be in a "appeal process" until we are dead.......But I tell ya Fred.......I marched for civil rights, I stood in the campus square with a bullhorn to protest the Viet Nam war. I though we had won when Nixon left the White House in disgrace. When Blacks could vote without literacy tests or poll taxes I didn't think there was anything left to fight for. When the last helicopter left the roof of the embassy in Saigon, it was time for me to "grow up" and start thinking about getting a good paying job and carving out my own piece of the great American Pie. But this Cindy Sheehan protest has made me think.....And it dawned on me that standing for democracy isn't a once-in-a-lifetime thing. It's never ending. And I'm never too old, too tired, too cynical or too rich or poor to stand on a street corner and tell the world it needs to change. Been thinking about all us old radicals from way back... If they thought we were a handful in our youth, whadda they gonna do now that we are older, wiser, and at a point where we don't really worry about tomorrows? With nothing to lose at this end of life, we could be some kinda trouble for the VA and the goverment........................ It strikes me as odd that the country asks 18 to 21 year olds to join the military and fight for the country. They really don't have the investment in it that us older folks have. What does my 18 year old have to protect? His stereo and CD collection? (Really it should be people my age, with a wife, the house, etc to protect, who should be asked to step up. Of course, I might be less likely than the average 18 year old to take a red-faced, yelling drill sargent seriously when he checks the shine of my shoes.)
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 06:59:16 (MDT)

Mark,thats just plain sick.Wheres the extra cheese?
alvis
USA - Friday, August 19, 2005 at 06:26:02 (MDT)

Good to hear from you Jack........QUESTION everybody.......what is your favorite bedtime snack. Or unusual one. Right now I just heated up a plate of 2 day old spagetti and put potato chips on it. MUMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!!!!!!.Love ya all............always a brother
Mark
USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 21:12:19 (MDT)

50 years ago,Fort Rucker was created.The anv, celeb. is oct 21,22.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 21:04:35 (MDT)

Do any of you guys out there remember the aircraft and crew that SP4 Matheson was killed when he threw out the WP Grenade? Was going thru acft accidents/incidents and he poped into my little head. I know that he didn't make it but I just can't tie the crew or the aircraft together. Maybe some of you old timers can remember. Also, for you old timers (around Mar 68) does anyone remember the civilian that worked in the sheet metal shop. He used to bring us the paper every morning. He was an older guy that I think worked for Dyn Electron. He used to have a jeep that he drove back and forth from Quin Houn. He was ambushed and killed on the way to work at the 129th one morning. Can't remember his name, but do recall the incident.Any old timers remember?
Jack Newton <SirIzk@centurytel.net>
Tomah, WI USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 20:40:58 (MDT)

fred Scaggs,they used THAT reasoning to deny me service connection for hepitetis (B and C)I came down with after nam.I made the mistake of admitting I had smoked pot before service.They claimed it was my lifestyle.While what you posted has great merits,it to is abused by the G men.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 10:07:11 (MDT)

Rick, I love you. Please feel free to check anything I write in here:>)) With a wink-Gently
Gently
USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 06:53:52 (MDT)

Rick England......That reevaluation for PTSD has been "a long time comin". Most the emphasis is gonna be put on "background research"......As we all know.....some guys were "criminals" and "psychopathic liars" BEFORE they went into service. Some had a choice of going to jail or to the service.......A guy I grew up with, Danny......He got into a fight and almost beat another kid to death, with a "ball bat".......The legal system then let Danny go into service and escape attempted murder charges.......Danny went to Nam.... and got "kicked out" service for "something" he did in Nam........In 1976 Danny murdered his wife, and put her body in the truck of a car and set it on fire. Danny was arrested for the murder in the first degree.......BUT....his lawyers contacted Danny`s "childhood" friends and wanted us to write letters to the judge, on Danny`s behalf.......They wanted to use the "PTSD" defense.......We all got together and talked about it.........But the bottom line was....Danny was always a bully and petty criminal........the WAR didn`t screw Danny up........My point is....Alot of guys were gangsters, BEFORE they went into service........I have "NO PROBLEM" weeding those people "out of the mix".......
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 06:04:09 (MDT)

one of the big reasons the old hemi's were phased out ( to my understanding) is emissions.The fuel injection systems available had a difficult time at idle with that beast,something about flow characteristics and the bloody things darn near melted your face with unburnt gas,hydrogen,ect. For anyone with a pocketfull of money and looking to spend it...smile,there is a one owner,1968 hemi roadrunner,14,000 miles, going up for auction here.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 06:02:48 (MDT)

My new hemi is a 5.9L 330 hp with the plugs in the middle still. I love it. They have a computer thingy hehehehehe called the predetor which gives it another 35 hp I am getting that and a tri filter system which helps gas milege. I got 19 miles to the gallon going home from san antonio. I don't drive much anymore but gas prices are up to 2.51 gal now.******** I talked to my shrink and she is helping by taking care of our records and said here in Az there shouldn't be much truble with the reevaluation on PTSD. I guess some states are going to be hit harder because they let allot of people slip through. 72,000 vets is 1 third of the PTSD claims. This is going to cost the government allot of money and take up time which could be better spent. I am sorry Judith, but this hets home for allot of vets with combat stressors who deserve it. I am sorry I doubted you I hope nobody that needs it doesn't get caught up in it. Flight be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Thursday, August 18, 2005 at 05:02:39 (MDT)

Wink,you out there buddy? we have a fire mission for you.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 21:57:20 (MDT)

Yankees got problems....But I`m watching my Cleveland Indians...they are playing good ball and C.C. can carry them to the playoffs, they remind me of the "94" Indians.......Oakland is "red hot" also......BoSox are a given.....One of those Marines from Ohio that got killed was Buddy Bell`s (Manager of the Royals) nephew, and Dave Bell`s(Philly) cousin.....The Bell`s are from Ohio, Gus Bell of the Cincy Reds is grandpa.
Fred Skaggs
Summit, NJ USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 18:09:43 (MDT)

The 'hemi' stands for hemispherical.That's the shape of the combustion chamber. The early engines were usually flatheads, with the valves in the block. Early overhead designs had the valves side by each, while the hemi had the valves on either side of the cylinder, with the spark plug in the middle. It made for better air flow, more complete burn, and better cooling. I don't know that it makes such a big difference any more, given all the technology that's gone into making engines breathe, exhaust valves don't break down because of excess heat like they used to. Freddie, now that you're officially a Joisey bum...whatabout them yankees??
Kim
Livermore, Me USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 16:45:14 (MDT)

Caught a ride into South Dakota........ With two girls in a light blue "57" 345ci 345 hp Hemi Desoto....... You know one's name was Jane...... The other was plain...... But they both had racing motors........ Next I caught a ride with a gamblers wife...... She had a brand new laid down 315 bhp,390 V8 "69" Rambler....... She stopped outside of town...... Laid the Rambler down...... Said she sure could dig it if I wrote her........
Fred Skaggs
Summit , NJ USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 12:40:05 (MDT)

Dave, Was Charlie the short Captain that carried a super-8 movie camera on missions? I remember seeing some of his C.A. movies at Lane. Just wondering, Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 12:37:17 (MDT)

I may sound stupid but what was the "hemi" engine. Sounds famillar but I can't remember the details. Frank Sep69-Mar70.
Frank Loveday
Bastrop, La. USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 10:53:48 (MDT)

these stupid post from vendors give me chronic anxiety attacks.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 06:43:25 (MDT)

I dont see him on the contacts page,perhaps one of out local members can find out if he is aware of us.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 17, 2005 at 04:41:48 (MDT)

Fred, yeah I believe I used to fly with Charlie.
Dave Powers
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 21:14:28 (MDT)

I forgot to add..no one was badly hurt in the helicopter crash.Its out of jacksonville fla.
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 17:42:36 (MDT)

gently....huh?
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 14:49:49 (MDT)

Subject: [HV] Helicopter accident Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 06:26:35 -0400 >We had a local medical helicopter end up on its side in someone's >back yard a couple of days ago. No injuries. > >Pilot was Charles Huggett, if anybody knows him. VHPA directory >says he was in the 129th in 70-71. > >http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/081505/met_19502878.shtml > >-- I saw this in helivets a few minutes ago.Anyone know or remember him?alvis
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 14:47:34 (MDT)

LOL :>))))
Gently
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 12:26:38 (MDT)

Brother!! :o]....what an imagination.
Gale
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 08:50:28 (MDT)

Fred!!! Happy Birthday big guy! Yikes! I"m sorry I missed it. The invitations you sent out for your party were great! I laughed for hours! Sounds like the food was good too...grilled lobster tail! That's my kind of meal! I hope the new swimming pool is working out..what a wonderful gift from Susan...wish I could have jumped in it as part of the Cannon Ball contest. I do make a good splash! Damn. And the band...yikes! You certainly have connections! CCR! You rock! I would have loved to make your Pool Birthday party ...I'm so bummed that I didn't. Will you invite me again next year? :>)) HB my friend-Gently
Gently
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 08:32:44 (MDT)

Thats right don't give up on the VA. JW chrylser did have the hemi I am sure my father in-law had one I thought it was a 53 if I am not mistaken. in school a buddy of mine had 60 chrylser with a hemi and another had a de soto with tirp deuces that hemi would beat him everytime. they both had the push button shifter. I forgotten about that till now. Flight be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Tuesday, August 16, 2005 at 06:07:35 (MDT)

Good evening Flight: Well have finally got in to the VA. They have sent me a ton of medication etc. Also set appointments for my hearing and ptsd. Got a denial on my knee and right foot. But, will have a review on that. It took over a year to get a primary care doctor. Had some help from a supervisor at the VA. Went on Aug.6th to get enrolled and started getting something every other day from the VA. All I can say is keep trying. Kal hope you get better soon. Will call and check on you tomorrow. Liz and I just returned from ohio. Visted my family and attended my 40th class reunion. Don't get on much right now since I am putting a lot of hours these days. Just wanted all of you to know that I do think of you often. Maybe I can start getting back on here once or twice a week when they decide to get me some help at the store. Alex
Alex
Collierville, Tn. USA - Monday, August 15, 2005 at 18:55:17 (MDT)

J.W. I'm sure that Plymouth didn't have a V-8 til 1955. Chrysler, Dodge & DeSoto did. I dunno!!
Gale
USA - Monday, August 15, 2005 at 15:38:29 (MDT)

Hi flight, Rick, I found a guy who worked at a dealership back then and say some hemi engines were in 51 plymouths
J.W. Wilson
USA - Monday, August 15, 2005 at 14:33:01 (MDT)

Alvis.....early worm gets the bird acording to a mortician friend of mine.........Keith
Keith 72-73
USA - Sunday, August 14, 2005 at 19:57:23 (MDT)

just went to Phils site in england.He has been flying the bird around a little.His site is really starting to take off.I am glad for him.
alvis
USA - Sunday, August 14, 2005 at 19:05:24 (MDT)

In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is.
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Sunday, August 14, 2005 at 14:57:02 (MDT)

the heavest day for kia's in vietnam///twas the 173rd. They lost 155 men in one day,fighting the nva.
alvis
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 20:48:46 (MDT)

just reading a few "stats" on the vietnam war. 10% of kia's were helicopter crews.of that 10%,the battle of lam son 719 took 10%,a battle of a mere 2 months.
alvis
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 20:46:17 (MDT)

I think Jaguar featured a hemi, in the late 40'S, Chrysler came out with one in 51. Like you, I remember a neighbor who had a Desoto, which had a hemi in it. I think they, like a lot of other manufacturers bought surplus engines(think jeep)and stuck them into their vehicles....... I flew with Mr Gilliland now and then, he was flying one day, when we got ASAP'd out of Pleiku. Unfortunately, on take off, we hooked a piece of PSP, and went on a five second ride, which seemed like an hour!! He got it down in one piece, sprung the landing gear pretty hard though.....that was the end of 212, it was shipped out for major maintenance. I didn't know it at the time, but, that was my last mission with the 129th.
Kim
Livermore, Me USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 18:40:38 (MDT)

"A squid eating dough in a polyethelene bag is vast and bulbous"- Capt. Beefheart
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 13:23:48 (MDT)

Rick, I am not sure. I asked around and some people think that in 52 some De Sota's had them
J.W. Wilson
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 12:32:53 (MDT)

austrailian kisses are alot like french kisses,but austrailian kisses are down under
ALVIS
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 10:09:13 (MDT)

If you're a Pilot, and your Crewchief and Gunner are Smiling, You Damn sure better find out "WHY" ?????.....
C.P.
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 08:16:21 (MDT)

A horse may be coaxed to drink, but a pencil must be lead.
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 08:02:59 (MDT)

a worm,digging in hard ground,finds that alot more relaxing than fishing or bird watching.
alvis
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 07:39:48 (MDT)

Mark you did your job were they sent you I am sure of that. Maybe this 129th page wouldn't have happened. You have done your job my brother. We thank you for that. We all have surviors quilt including you so you were there. Like Joe Campbell said to me when someone asks you when you were there you say last night. We have met each other because of you. Love Rick Be careful out there.
Rick England
USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 05:58:39 (MDT)

Nice story Fred. Happy birthday, and my best to Susan. Aloha, Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Saturday, August 13, 2005 at 00:04:50 (MDT)

Fred..........July of 71, I was about 1200 miles northeast of you... on Okinawa........to stop and think that you guys were dieing while I skated on that rock of an island just blows my mind. Wish I could of been there to help you........always a brother.............
Mark
USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 21:25:28 (MDT)

make that buck sergent
alvis
USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 17:20:47 (MDT)

I arrived in Cham Ron bay July 17th,1971.I remember it being hot and smelled funny.Alot more calmer than I has imagined and alot more calmer than I was on the inside.We were all asigned temperary quarters,issued gearand given a few classes.The excitement was like xmas,in the way we were all awaiting our permanet duty stations.Thats all we talked about and all we wanted to do..get to our duty stations and be permanent party.It took about 3 days.Unfortunately,the powers that be pulled handfulls of fng's out of regular posting for the perpose of pulling guard duty around cham ron AO,lasting about 4 weeks.I was one of these unfortunates.I remember Aug 12th in vietnam for two reasons.Let me tell you about the first one.I was in a guard tower along side the china sea beach,with the nurses quarters on the other side of us.Now,being new in country,no-one,and I mean no-one, fell asleep during guard duty.We were all to scared,being cherry boys.The night of aug 12th,unfolded in much the same way as any other night,black darkness,cool sea breezes,all quiet.Now the saragent of the guard,a young buck,no one liked,and lifer to the max,liked to sneak around to try and catch folks sleeping.About 2 in the morning,I spotted him flitting from shadow to shadow,getting closer to my tower.Being the playful person I am,I called out.."hey,can I help you with something?". He froze in the shadows for a few minutes,then started darting from shadow to shadow ,still comming closer.Again,I repeated my most unmilitary question.Still no response..and the same thing happened again.This time...after speaking again,I pulled back the handle of my M-16,let it bang forward,locking and loading,full automatic.Now, at 2 in the morning in vietnam,you can hear a frog fart from a hundred yards away.This saragent starts yelling and waving his arms,stepping into the light to I can see him.He sure was pissed. He came up into the quard tower, still yelling and screaming,called me everything but an american,and informed me that I was NOW on report.After he left,all us new guys were laughing at the idiot.The next day,nothing was said,no ever after.The other reason i remember Aug 12th,1971,was that I turned 21 that night,in that guard tower.Hell of a birthday.
alvis
USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 15:16:13 (MDT)

I have sent out pictures ,I just recieved,to everyone on my e-mail list.Please forward them to others that want to see them.The pics are of 509,the 129th ahc ship Phil has rebuilt and now is in England.Looks better than the ones we flew in.Phi; has done an outstanding job.
alvis
USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 14:51:19 (MDT)

Kal, glad you got out of that with your life. I think most of us that ride have gotten scares like that and some how been able to stop the bike in time knowing that one of these times we might not be so lucky. I hope you heal up fast and by the way how bad was the Victory banged up? I agree that things happen in 3's and I have been riding my bike to work all summer. I'll have to make an effort to be extra careful when riding now. Slow hand salute to Ken Kinnie, and condolences to anyone that was close to him. Rick....Heh heh heh.........Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 10:32:46 (MDT)

Rick, I pray I am wrong. L-Gently
Gently
USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 06:54:59 (MDT)

JW isn't that the first hemi made? That is worth some money whoa!******Alemaster we will see you at Fiddlers Green a hand salute.******Judith I herad that they are going to do some reevaluations on in country vets and some that slip through the system with no combat stressors. I am going to the Vet Center today I will do some more investigations on this. I love you like a sister Judith and you have given us good info before I just hope your wrong on this one. Please don't get mad at me. I just want to make sure. Love you all and please be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Friday, August 12, 2005 at 05:48:26 (MDT)

My condolences to ones who lost love ones. Kal, I wish you a speedy recovery. Gale, a son-in-law just bought a one owner 53 New Yorker {71,000 miles on it} with a 331 hemi engine in mint condition
J.W. Wilson
USA - Thursday, August 11, 2005 at 15:14:06 (MDT)

Yes, a respectful salute Sir, there is a pic at the San Antonio Reunion of Vic Gilliland who was "Alemaster" When i was there. Please know that he carried that name with Honor & still does. God go with you. As for the Neuropathy Fred, it just seems to get worse, Sometimes i am up most of the night with pain. I am probably going to have to stand this review that Judith is talking about even though the VA retired me. I just hope i can stay in check. I get so angry. Everyone get to doing a little better soon. We must believe that God will take care of us,sometimes he is all i have to hang on to & you folks who understand>>>Love & Respects>>>Smitty
jim westwang 71-72
sheridan, wy USA - Thursday, August 11, 2005 at 14:44:43 (MDT)

a slow ,respectful ,hand salute rendered.See you at L.Z. Fiddelers Green.
alvis
USA - Thursday, August 11, 2005 at 14:21:42 (MDT)

Amen, Jack. Amen. Smitty......geez! There is a philosophy that things happen in threes....so let's all be alittle more aware out here. Please. Rick, PTSD claim reviews will go back to 1999 and the VA wants "proof" for your claim. Even if you've already shown such you will have to show such again. So for those of you who didn't have "proof" you might want to get such. I view this as just another way for them to save money(cheat the Vet), especially after they had to come up with "a bit" more several weeks ago because they underestimated the need for care of our Iraqi and Afghanistan Vets. Just my thoughts. L-G
Gently
USA - Thursday, August 11, 2005 at 07:03:59 (MDT)

The 129th has lost one of the best Helicopter Gunship Pilots who ever lived. Ken Kinnie passed away this week in Sacamento, Ca. Ken served with the Cobras in 1969 as Cobra Alemaster. Ken was my Aircraft Commander and friend. Ken's service is being held 1100 hours, Saturday 13 August at Regencey Park Elementry School, 5901 Bridge Crest Drive, Sacamento. He will be remebered by all the people who served with him and all the children he taught for 30 years after serving his country in Viet Nam. God speed, Alemaster. Cobra Bishop
Jack Alexander <CPTJAC@msn.com>
Medina, OH USA - Thursday, August 11, 2005 at 06:17:04 (MDT)

Evenin' Folks........wow.lots happnin' here......David Wells, our condolences to you and your family, but rest assured that your pop is aready being cradled in the savior's arms........Gently...forgive me sister, you probably told me and I forget, or you probably posted it here and I forgot, or somebody else told me and I forgot, but I am sorry to here about the lose of your farther. I tell ya, I think sometimes I forget more now that I am sobor then I did when I drank. Don't worry though, I'll take the forgetfulness over the blizzard of miserableness. kal, whewwwww...close call brother, and to think we rode all those miles to TX with out a nitch. Praise the Lord you are well.......Well, some of you may recall the 173rd "HERD" that used to celibrate Christmas at the Pop-A-Top, they are in town this weekend at the local airport for their annual jumpfest. Plans are to have a UH-1H along with a Blackhawk there Friday and an F16 flyover Saturday. I have been doing some errands for them to help get supplies and what not for them Fresh water, sponsors, and the such. I will be playing in their golf tourney Friday and will say the grace at their Friday meal in honor of Spence and another one that has passed away. Might set up my Kokomo tent and stay over one night there this weekend also. Anybody that would like to attend ,"Come on Down, or over, or up ". They have always treated me so nice that I feel honored that they ask me to help them. It is the least I can do for them, as it is for you all. Jeff, happy B/day brother......just another day. Ray, brother, keep a stiff upper lip brother and as CP always write KTF...............still having a hard time setting things up for my mother of the age of 90. Insurance game seems to be like the VA game as far as trying to get something out of them. Always saying more of what they wont do then what they will. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!................take care all.......I love you and God Bless.........always a brother..........Mark
Mark
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 19:47:04 (MDT)

Smitty,is the nuropathic extremity pain getting any better?
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 19:28:41 (MDT)

Hey folks... Thanks for the well wishes.. Just a short note on the accident.. Not only was he DUI, he had open intox in the truck. I understand he spent some time in jail and may still be there as far as I know.. The courts and insurance companys will have a field-day with this, as they should. Too many cyclists are killed or maimed every year by people like that.. Love you'all and take care... Oh Smitty.. Yes, thank God.. He must know something good about us. Glad you had the same guy lookin after you also...C U L8r...Kal...>>>
Kal Bergstrom 67/68
Saint Joseph, MI USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 19:17:59 (MDT)

KAL; you obviously have forgotten the days when sex was safe and motorcycles were dangerous. will catch you on msn. i always hated digging the pebbles out of the road rash. catch ya soon. hope ya didn't hurt the boat
paul mcgrath
oglesby, il USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 16:16:44 (MDT)

Kal thank god you're ok. Rest up and take care, and let that new nurse take care of you for awhile. Smitty, glad to hear you survived another sturgis, that was always a dream but now that i can't ride probably will never make one. Take care all, da stickman is outta here
jim "stickman" oliver
pembroke, ga USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 15:22:51 (MDT)

Kal I told you be careful out there. Judith this is not the signal I am getting here in Az. There are are some in country vets getting 100% I thought you had to have combat stressors for that. Maybe you should talk to Karen. I would like to hear more. Be careful out there
Rick England
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 15:05:52 (MDT)

Kal, very thankful to hear you are alive, we know it can happen any time. Linda & I just got back from Sturgis, We saw 1 person life flighted & were stopped in hundreds of motorcycles for 1/2 hour while they did that but i was too far back to see what happened. Sturgis very big this year, just seems bigger all the time. When we were coming back a guy didn't have his awning on his trailer tied up right & it blew off & we almost hit it at 75 but i got in between the canvas & another piece ( lucky). Hope you are well soon Kal, & Susan I hope you are doing better again soon as well. I saw the Doc at the VA the other day & he is not real thrilled with how i am doing but???????I'll keep trying to do better>>>>>love & respects>>> Smitty
jim westwang 71-72
sheridan, wy USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 14:43:45 (MDT)

Oh Kal! Thank God! Really...thank God! Now get repaired for your daughter's wedding. C.P. and Fred, thank you for the heads up as soon as you heard about his accident. You're the best! Jeff, it is normal routine in here to do a short bio on one's birthday.....so? And many happy more. Roger....where are you? Frenchie....? Susan and Jim, Joe and I taking the WI families who lost a loved one in Iraq or Afghanistan to the Highground on August 27th and 28th. Why don't you join us? Ron Paye may. Call Ann Buslee and ask her to stop in. And bring a dish to share:>)) for approx 50 people:>))) L-G
Gently
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 13:46:38 (MDT)

GOOD afternoon flight, and I should say GREAT as I am still alive.. As CP said I had a rather serious acciden on the bike Sunday night on my way to work. I had a fellow in a pickup truck pull out in frount on me and I thought that was no problem till I saw the 24 foot boat he was pulling behind him. In the excitemen of things I must have locked things up because the next think I knew I was doing an end over and rolling to a stop. Last thing I remember seeing was this boat that was as big as a house and it was right in frount of me, I still don't know what kept me from going under it and its wheels..Thank you, thank you!!!!!. Anyway, I have a few broken bones and some "road rash" to go along the aches and pains that accompany that kind of thing. I am finding out how hard it is to do some of the common everyday things without a thumb, as that was one of the things that broken.. I go to the Orthopedic Surgon tomorrow for the final casts and seeing just how bad things really are. So I guess that as bad things may seem, I should be happy as I still and alive and somewhat functional. I should be off work for a while and that should help me get rested up for retirement...HaHa.. Happy Bday Jeff and I hope all of you folks are doing well.. Take care.....Kal....>>>
Kal Bergstrom 67/68
Saint Joseph, MI USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 11:18:57 (MDT)

Kal says he has a broken ankle,a broken elbow and a broken thumb,all on the left side.His ribs are brusied severly and left knee is hamburger look-alike.He goes to see the doc again tommorow for more in depth care and investagation.He will keep us updated.A rtuck ,pulling a boat,pulled out in front of Kal on his(Kals) way to work last night.Kal put the bike down resulting in his injurys .Dont know if he actually hit the boat.The guy took off..didnt even stop.They caught him a few miles down the road.Kal,road the bike to work afterwards,boss took him home,shirley took him to hosp.He is in pain,but resting.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 10:55:24 (MDT)

hey flight, Just got word that Kal Berstrom was involved in a serious motorcycle accident...... he's pretty banged up, but home right now...... ktf
C.P.
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 10:38:11 (MDT)

happy birthday jeff.Now,what about a short bio?
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 08:11:28 (MDT)

Amen. Slow ,respectful hand salute rendered.The passing of ones father is loosing the gentle,strong,sometimes fearce hand that guided our lives from the begining.His words still ring in your heart as you pass them on to your children.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 08:09:56 (MDT)

56 years old today. Seems like only yesterday I was having my 21st at Lane! Wells family we are sorry for your loss. You are in our prayers. Everyone take care. By the way- has anyone heard from Cups? I worry about that boy. Snapper
Jeff
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 07:58:28 (MDT)

I meant WELLS, sorry about the confusion....
C.P.
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 06:48:14 (MDT)

Dave, our prayers are with you and your family at this time. It's very difficult to lose a parent; it wasn't that long ago that Mark and I lost our fathers and it broke our hearts. The 129th is here for you. Call any of us. With a hug-Gently
Gently
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 06:47:47 (MDT)

Well, Do you want to tell us about it?????? We're here and will listen..... ktf,
C.P.
USA - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 at 06:46:49 (MDT)

Dad, Ken awaits you in your final hours. Fear not as he will guide you. Let not your heart be toubled.
Wells <dswells62@bellsouth,net>
Roswell, Ga USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 22:57:27 (MDT)

Hey Don, The mysterious tool has been used by myself for strecting barbed wire to keep the stubborn dairy cows in, cuz they thought the grass was greener on the other side of the fence. info from past life,other wife and before RVN. Dennis
Dennis Fuerstenau <dpf092003@yahoo.com>
Haines City, Fl USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 17:49:58 (MDT)

It looks like the tool they use for wire bands on crates
Lou Rags
Dover, De USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 17:39:25 (MDT)

don you sure its not a skid shoe adjustment tool. lol
donnie purvis <donnie.purvis@us.army.mil>
lexnigton, nc USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 12:18:00 (MDT)

Oh, oh. "The U.S. government is reviewing 72,000 cases in which veterans have been diagnosed with severe post-traumatic stress disorder, claiming that misdiagnosis and fraud have inflated the numbers. Outraged vets say the plan is a callous attempt to cut the costs of an increasingly expensive war." Mark Benjamin, Salon, August 9, 2005
Gently
USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 10:11:00 (MDT)

Don, I believe it's a Rotor Washer...... One of the old ones where you have to pump that handle really hard to get the RPM up to match the blades speed...... I'm kinda surprised you guys didn't recognize it, but you wouldn't unless you flew on the OH-23, Raven........ Not that I'm old or anything...... ktf
C.P.
USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 06:56:11 (MDT)

Don, I believe that may be a Flatangelum, and a left handed one at that......................... LOL, Greg
Animal
Puna, HI USA - Tuesday, August 09, 2005 at 01:44:30 (MDT)

Don, it looks like some sort of cinching machine,or for some sort of banding.Hard to tell from the pix.
alvis
USA - Monday, August 08, 2005 at 21:53:53 (MDT)

Lou, Ray, and Susan you remain in my prayers. With hugs-Gently
Gently
USA - Monday, August 08, 2005 at 15:25:22 (MDT)

I put up a new web page. it has nothing to do with anything important. it is just some jokes and some pic's. please look at the pic's and let me know if you can help identify the tool shown. a friend found this in an old barn and would like to know what it is. http://donald_6.tripod.com/funpage.htm Later, Don
Don Miller
Valley Farms, AZ USA - Monday, August 08, 2005 at 14:48:46 (MDT)

do what ever it takes,brother Ray.Susan is having a horrible day.the chemo is over but the side effects arent.I think back into the wheelchair today. She has spent all morning crying cause of the pain,poor thing is just tired of hurting.Stiches out next week from her lastest operation.Called the chemo doc,not much they can do,just more pills and THAT isnt an answer.Gotta go take care of my girl,later,alvis.
alvis
USA - Monday, August 08, 2005 at 08:10:17 (MDT)

HELLO TO JUST SAYING HI NOT TO MUCH TO SY BUT TO THE ONE WHO IS PUTTING ALL THE TRASH WHY DO YOU BOTHER US WITH YOUR THASH I DONT THINK ANY ONE READS IT. DO YOU THINK YOU CAN FIND ANOTHER SIGHT TO PLACE YOUR TRASH THIS IS A PLACE OF HEALING AND FAMILY WE COME HERE TO TALK, WE JUST SCROLL THREW YOUR TRASH SO I ASH YOU TOFIND A DIFFRENT PLACE TO GO. ALEX THANKS FOR THE CALL. WELL SOON IT WILL BE WEND , OH SUE IF YOU FEEL YOUR EARS BURING ITS ME THING OF YOU LOL ;-))) ALVIS HOPE YOU DONT MIND LOL BUT I DO DREAD IT. BUT AT LEAST THEY MAY FINILY FIND OUT WHATS WRONG OH ROB GOOD TALKING TOYOU TO I THINK WE TALKED I FORGET MORE BUT I NEVER FORGET YOU AL;L WELL HEEP THIS SHORT LOVE YA ALL A BROTHER ALWAYS RAY
RAY <stilwating2AOL.COM>
STEET MD, md USA - Monday, August 08, 2005 at 06:40:56 (MDT)

dad-burn door to door peddlers. Ma,wheres my shotgun?
alvis
USA - Sunday, August 07, 2005 at 06:28:45 (MDT)

I cant read no stinking eyetalian.Who needs that durn stinking book learning anyway.no how,no way,is how us-ins do it in the hills. Dadburn yankees is most likely behind this eyetalian writting anyway.
alvis
USA - Saturday, August 06, 2005 at 17:53:17 (MDT)

EVERYTHING I EVER NEEDED TO KNOW ABOUT LIFE, I LEARNED AS A HELICOPTER PILOT IN VIETNAM Once you are in the fight, it is way too late to wonder if this is a good idea. Helicopters are cool! It is a fact that helicopter tail rotors are instinctively drawn toward trees, stumps, rocks, etc. While it may be possible to ward off this natural event some of the time, it cannot, despite the best efforts of the crew, always be prevented. It's just what they do. NEVER get into a fight without more ammunition than the other guy. The engine RPM, and the rotor RPM, must BOTH be kept in the GREEN. Failure to heed this commandment can affect the morale of the crew. A billfold in your hip pocket can numb your leg and be a real pain in the ass. Cover your Buddy, so he can be around to cover for you. Letters from home are not always great. The madness of war can extract a heavy toll. Please have exact change. Share everything. Yes, even the Pound Cake. Decisions made by someone over your head will seldom be in your best interest. The terms "Protective Armor" and "Helicopter" are mutually exclusive. The further away you are from your friends, the less likely it is that they can help you when you really need them the most. Sometimes, being good and lucky still was not enough. There is always payback. "Chicken Plates" (protective armor) are not something you order in a restaurant. If everything is as clear as a bell, and everything is going exactly as planned, you're about to be surprised. The BSR (Bang Stare Red) Theory states that the louder the sudden bang in the helicopter, the quicker your eyes will be drawn to the gauges. The longer you stare at the gauges, the less time it takes them to move from green to red. It does too get cold in Vietnam. No matter what you do, the bullet with your name on it will get you. So too can the ones addressed "To Whom It May Concern". Gravity: It may not be fair, but it is the law. If the rear echelon troops are really happy, the front line troops probably do not have what they need. If you are wearing body armor, they will probably miss that part. It hurts less to die with a uniform on, than to die in a hospital bed. Happiness is a belt fed weapon. If something hasn't broken on your helicopter, it's about to. Eat when you can. Sleep when you can. Shit when you can. The next opportunity may not come around for a long time. If ever. Combat pay is a flawed concept. Having all your body parts intact and functioning at the end of the day, beats the alternative. Air superiority is NOT a luxury. If you are allergic to lead, it is best to avoid a war zone. It is a bad thing to run out of airspeed, altitude, and ideas all at the same time. While the rest of the crew may be in the same predicament, it's usually the pilot's job to arrive at the crash site first. When you shoot your gun, clean it the first chance you get. Loud sudden noises in a helicopter WILL get your undivided attention. Hot garrison chow is better than hot C-rations which, in turn are better than cold C-rations, which are better than no food at all. All of these, however, are preferable to cold rice balls even if they do have the little pieces of fish in them. WHAT is often more important than WHY? Boxes of cookies from home must be shared. Girlfriends are fair game. Wives are not. Everybody's a hero ... on the ground ... in the club ... after the fourth drink. There is no such thing as a small firefight. A free fire zone has nothing to do with economics. The further you fly into the mountains, the louder the strange engine noises become. Medals are OK, but having your body and all your friends in one piece at the end of the day is better. Being shot hurts. "Pucker Factor" is the formal name of the equation that states the more hairy the situation is, the more of the seat cushion will be sucked up your asshole. It can be expressed in its mathematical formula of S(suction)+ H(height above ground) + I(interest in staying alive) + T(# of tracers coming your way). Thus the term 'SHIT!' can also be used to denote a situation where a high Pucker Factor is being encountered. Thousands of Vietnam Veterans earned medals for bravery every day. A few were even awarded. Running out of pedal, fore or aft cyclic, or collective are all bad ideas. Any combination of these can be deadly. Nomex is NOT fire proof. There is only one rule in war: When you win, you get to make up the rules. Living and dying can both hurt a lot. Do not wear underwear. It can cause crotch rot or be used as evidence against you. While a Super Bomb could be considered one of the four essential building blocks of life, powdered eggs cannot. C-4 can make a dull day fun. Cocoa Powder is neither. There is no such thing as a fair fight-only ones where you win or lose. If you win the battle you are entitled to the spoils. If you lose you don't care. Nobody cares what you did yesterday or what you are going to do tomorrow. What is important is what you are doing-NOW-to solve our problem. If you have extra-share quickly. It's OK to take stuff off the body of a buddy, 'cause you know he would have wanted you to have it anyway. Always make sure someone has a P-38. A sucking chest wound may be God's way of telling you it's time to go home. Prayer may not help . . . but it can't hurt. Flying is better than walking. Walking is better than running. Running is better than crawling. All of these however, are better than extraction by a Med-Evac, even if it is technically, a form of flying. If everyone does not come home, none of the rest of us can ever fully come home either. Do not fear the enemy, for your enemy can only take your life. It is far better that you fear the media, for they will steal your HONOR. A grunt is the true reason for the existence of the helicopter. Every helicopter flying in Vietnam had one real purpose: To help the grunt. It is unfortunate that many helicopters never had the opportunity to fulfill their one true mission in life, simply because someone forgot this fact. "You have the right to remain silent," is always EXCELLENT advice. "NEVER FORGET!
Larry Kwiatkowski
Simi Valley, CA USA - Friday, August 05, 2005 at 00:31:00 (MDT)

Hey Gale & Debby, we're ready for that visit! Any plans?? Wonderful news about Susan! Gas went to $2.55/gal this afternoon, and that was at Fleet Farm which is always cheaper than anyone else! Pretty soon Sue will have to work not for retirement benefits down the road, but to keep us in gas for the vehicles and fuel for heat in the winter! Jim
Jim & Sue H.
USA - Thursday, August 04, 2005 at 21:02:26 (MDT)

YEAH!!!! Little Aussie Girl! You did it! And now you probably be able to beat me up for calling you a "Little Aussie Girl! Yikes! Ray, my sweet friend---keep Susan in your mind the whole time..the whole time. And we will keep you in our prayers, you know that. Ron Paye!!!! Stop sending me jokes and get in here and post! C.P. :>))) L-Gently
Gently
USA - Thursday, August 04, 2005 at 13:25:19 (MDT)

My prayers to the Ohio families. Gently
gently
USA - Thursday, August 04, 2005 at 13:19:00 (MDT)

Bill, got the 2005 pics and they were great. Thanks and keep up the good work. Fred, It's nice to hear good news and I guess it couldn't be much better for you and Sue. Ray, I hope all goes well for you. Let me know and I love ya Brother.....Rob
Robbie
Rochester, NY USA - Wednesday, August 03, 2005 at 18:13:52 (MDT)

THANKS ALVIS I GET IT DONE ON THE 10th I BE THINKING ALL THAT SUE BEEN THREW SO I KNOW I CAN DO IT JUST DONT LIKE THE THE UNKNOWN I GUESS. MAK OR BILL BY CHANCE DO YOU HAVE A PHOTO OF THE PIC OF JUEUS YOU TOOK ON ON BIKE OR TELL ME HOW I CAN FIND IT SO I CAN PRINT IT FOR MY GRAND SON, HE LOVEDIT I TOLD HIM HOW COME IT WAS THERE WAS THERE THANKS I WONT SAY MUCK TAKE CARE MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS CC ARE YOU OK I WROTE YOU A FEW TIMES BE SAFE ALL. TAKE CARE ALL.I HAVE MANY DR APPT AND HECK NOT MANY BY THE VA THEY ALL TOLD ME TO USE MY WIFES INS OH WELL THEY DO GIVE ME THE MEDICIAN SO I GUESS THEY HELP. THEY STILL WANT ME TO SEE THE SHRINK MORE OH WELL A BROTHER ALWAYS RAY LOVE YA ALL BILL THANKS FOR ALL YOU DONE.I CALL SOME SOOM I JUST HURT IN PLACES I SHOULDNT I GOT TO CALL HIM TOMORROW TO IT T NEVER ENDS
RAY
MD USA - Wednesday, August 03, 2005 at 16:35:34 (MDT)

good luck on your test Ray, we will be thinking of you.You take care of yourself and listen to Gail,she has good sense and is pretty smart as well. She loves you, we all love ya Ray,,you the man.
alvis
USA - Wednesday, August 03, 2005 at 12:45:42 (MDT)

HELLO TO ALL . BILL THANKS FOR THE DVD, I PLAYEDIT FOR MY GRAND KIDS , HE LOVE THE PIC OF JEUS ON MARHS BIKE...WELL DO YOU RECALL ME TELL YOU I THOUGHT I WAS DOING BETTER WELL SOMETHING PUSHED ME BACK, DONT MEAN TO SOUND LIKE A WINER. BUT THE I HAD A DR DO SOME DIFFRENT BLOOD WOOK ON ME IT SEEMS NY BLOOD HAS A HIGH COUNT OF RED OF BLOOD CELLS AND I HAVE TO MUCH BLOOD IN ME. SAID HE MAY HAVE TO TAKE SOME OUT. I NEVER HEARD OF THAT. BUT FRIST I HAVE TO HAVE A BONE MAURAL TEST DONE, I GOT TO CALL FOR AN APPT AFTER I SEND THIS, I HEARD THEY HURT A LOT NOT LOOKING FORWARD TO THAT AT ALL, IAND JUST WHEN I THOUGHT WHEN I WAS DOING BETTER, I GO TO UROLIGIST TOMORROR TO SEE IF THE RED BLOOD CELLS ARE GONE NOW ITS THE OPPSIT I CANT GO AND HURTS WHEN I GO I TELL YA IAM ABOUT TO GIVE UP CANT WIN . I GOT TO GO BACK AND SEE MY PRIMEY CARE DR TODAY WAS THERE YESTERDAY WANSTS ME BACK TO DAY TO NOT WHING JUST LETTING YOU KNOW I GUESS AND SCARED TO DEATH OF THE BONE MAREAL TEST I KNOW THEY HURT BAD. OH WELL OUT OF MY HANDS I GUESS. BUT IAM SICK OF DRs. WELL I GUESS I SAID ENOUGH , I GUESS IF SUE CAN GO THREW WHAT SHE HAS GONE THREW I KNOW I SHOULD BE ABLE TO, I GUESS IT NOT KNOWING WHAT TO EXPECT IS WHAT SCARES ME SUE I BE THINKING ALL YOU HAVE HONE THREW AS THEY DO MY TEST, THE ONLY THING THING IAM AWAKE DONT LIKE THAT THANKS FOR LISTING A BROTHER ALWAYS RAY AND ONE WHO IS SCARED TO DEATH BE SAFE IT WAS GOOD SEEING YOU ALL
RAY <Stilwating@aol.com>
MD USA - Wednesday, August 03, 2005 at 07:13:44 (MDT)

keep the good news coming fred. great! wink 3/69-10/70
wink
USA - Wednesday, August 03, 2005 at 07:09:53 (MDT)

great news Fred and Sue....prayers still said for you...........Keith
Keith 72-73
USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 21:09:09 (MDT)

what a blessing for you sue, i myself am a 5 year survivor of radical prostate cancer surgery. In that time frame i also lost my wife 3 years ago on 8 may so i truly know what a blessing it is to be cancer free,,,yeah,,,hey it's hot down this way how bout the rest of you all, sticks outta here, got cut grass
Jim "stickman" oliver
Pembroke, ga USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 17:19:55 (MDT)

Susan & Fred, glad you got some good news, you were overdue. Love & respects, Smitty
jim westwang 71-72
sheridan, wy USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 11:41:45 (MDT)

GALE thanks for the directions, that should clear up questions. see ya in kokomo
paul mcgrath
oglesby, il USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 11:41:10 (MDT)

I forgot to add....thank all of you for your well wishes AND prayers.You guys did good.Thanks cp.
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 11:00:58 (MDT)

Great news Fred A......
C.P.
USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 10:53:59 (MDT)

Test are in. No sign of cancer in remaining tissue. Radiation treatments are next,then finished. 4 to 6 weeks from now,life returns to normal,whatever that is. We have been dealing with this since dec.,it seems like a normal way of life. Will be happy for the change.
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 10:51:29 (MDT)

contract killing..naaa...defense fund? hummm,now thats an idea.
alvis
USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 07:31:30 (MDT)

hey fred i like the new name but lets also add a.k.a. hanoi jane to it. we don't want people to think that jihad jane is a different scum bag from hanoi jane.we should put a contract out on her. it would save this country a lot of pain. if she wants to do something to help, well she should give her money to the many poor of this country.but i guess that would be to much to ask of her. areal true american,she is.wink 3/69-10/70
wink
lake wales, USA - Tuesday, August 02, 2005 at 07:28:06 (MDT)

GALE; sent email addy last week. may have had trouble with yours. here it is again ida paul & yahoo.com. or did you want snail mail?
paul mcgrath <idapaul &yahoo.com>
oglesby, il USA - Monday, August 01, 2005 at 11:35:58 (MDT)

Well flight,Susan went hatless at work yesterday and feels comfy.She states she intends to continue going hatless.This doesnt sound like a big deal to us guys,but the ladies know full well the depths of this move.Look out world,she is coming back.
alvis
USA - Monday, August 01, 2005 at 08:22:15 (MDT)

Perhaps a new name for Hanio jane is due...how about ( and I say this with tounge in cheek) "Jihad jane".Her holy war (to herself,for herself and about herself) is starting again in March.Maybe sombody will finally bust a cap on her ass,but,she isnt worth the jail time it would cost.I suppose that would mean that she won after all.May she hit lots of speed bumps,pot holes,curbs,flat tires,and run out of vegie oil for fuel.
alvis
USA - Monday, August 01, 2005 at 08:17:17 (MDT)

hey bill great dvd, very nicly done.. not having a dvd player i played over at sisters houseand with my son. they loved also.after watching the dvd my sister sujested that it would be nice to have before an after pictures of us.what you think/ should be very interesting. well i guess our friend jane the ***** is at it again. a bus tour, don,t that beat all.i hope the bus finds a cliff an goes over it. i wonder if she going to take her show to iraq. i don't think so but if she does an i hope so, maybe we'll get gustist. i didn't think her apoligy a few years back meant anything. but i think of us knew that. oh time well tell. hope everything is well on everyones home front. my best to all. wink 3/69-10/70
wink
lake wales, fl USA - Monday, August 01, 2005 at 07:38:58 (MDT)